Brakes tandem axles

[moshe1436]

I have owned this Salem Cruise-Lite 241 QBXL for over a month and I’m concerned about the braking action. When coming to a stop the brakes grab/release, grab/release several times before coming to a complete stop. I have a Prodigy 2 controller and find it really difficult to adjust it so that “chucking” action doesn’t happen. If I get it adjusted so that doesn’t happen I don’t have any breaking action at higher speeds. Yesterday I almost sailed through a red light because of that - thankfully there wasn’t anyone waiting at the light ahead of me! I can’t figure out what needs to be done to correct this problem. Any suggestions? Thanks
Mo

[merlinhomeauto]

Sounds like a bad connection or bad controller.

[moshe1436]

Originally Posted by merlinhomeauto

Sounds like a bad connection or bad controller.

The controller is new. But I'm not sure it was installed correctly by my local mechanic and not a trailer specialist. How do I check to see if it's a bad connection or a poorly installed controller?

[Hthunder]

Possibly a grounding issue.

[youroo]

Since this is a used 2014 unit I would have the drums removed and see what is the condition of the Brake Assy! Youroo!!

[Brother Les]

I think that it is installed fine. Electric brakes (trailer) are a different animal than hydraulic (tow vehicle). The Electric brake is activated by an electric current going to a magnet that grabs the hub. This magnet is attached to a swing arm and that arm will push the brake pads outward to drag on the hub. The higher the current, the harder that the magnet will grab the hub, the heavier the pads will drag on the hubs. What you describe is the magnet grabbing and letting go, when you are going at a slow speed. The brake pads are also, it seems to be grabbing also. A little wear on the brake pads will lighten this action of the b pads grabbing. As for the magnet, grab action, there is a fineness on tuning the power level of not working/ grab and letting go/ too tight. This is part of the learning process.

As for almost going through a red light.... that is on you... never trust the braking control or power of your camper to help stop you. Slow down and keep a lot of space between you and anyone in front of you or you will re-end someone. it will not go well at all if you do that. Your camping trip will not be very good if you get in an accident going camping or going home.

Think Safety, First and Always....

[mwdilday]

Not sure how familiar you are with electric trailer brakes and adjusting controllers. This controller only has two adjustments on it. The button is the boost and the knob is the power. Here is a link to the instructions. You may have the boost set too high. Your trailer looks like it is pretty light so you are not going to want a high boost. The instructions give you guidelines on setting boost and power. Good luck.

http://www.hitchpro.com/Application/...ons/N90885.pdf

[2Evil4U]

My suggestion would be to check the mechanical adjustment of the brake shoes. I have a car hauler that would do exactly what you describe when it was unloaded. Turned out that the brake shoes had too much clearance to the drums and when the brakes activated the mechanism would go over-center and grab. I spread the shoes out using the adjuster until they just lightly dragged and it fixed the problem.

[moshe1436]

Thanks to: Hthunder; youroo; Brother Les; mwdilday; 2Evil4U -- all of you have provided some great material for me to investigate.

I do have the Prodigy 2 manual but quite honestly I find it challenging to figure out. But I'm sure with more serious study and trial and error I can figure it out. Since I'm not sure how many miles this trailer has seen, just because of its age I'm sure the shoes needs to be adjusted. I think I can do that. For many years I operated and fixed hydraulic brake boat trailers up to 38 feet in length. So I have some experience with adjusting brake shoes and I don't imagine there is much difference between hydraulic brake shoe and electric brake shoes.

I feel I should trust the installation to be correct because the guy I used actually went to his "trailer" guy to give him help with the job. This shows me if he wasn't sure he sought good advice from someone he trusted. He's done a lot of work for me over the years.

As I review all of your suggestions I think my problem is not having the controller set correctly. In frustration I have been messing with the knobs and buttons not really knowing what I was doing. So based on what I'm reading in the controller manual I'm sure I have really screwed up the settings.

Thanks again for all your input! I keep repeating that this Forum is a wonderful source of information that I don't think would be available anywhere else on the web.

Mo

[moshe1436]

Additional question regarding the brakes on my 2014 Salem Cruise-Lite 241QBXL T.T.: Does this trailer come with self-adjusting brakes? If so I'm assuming they don't need to be adjusted?? Thanks,

Mo

[youroo]

Originally Posted by moshe1436

Additional question regarding the brakes on my 2014 Salem Cruise-Lite 241QBXL T.T.: Does this trailer come with self-adjusting brakes? If so I'm assuming they don't need to be adjusted?? Thanks,

Mo

All the more reason to remove the drums,the "Track Record" on the self adjust is shaky at times! Youroo!!

[Brother Les]

Originally Posted by moshe1436

Additional question regarding the brakes on my 2014 Salem Cruise-Lite 241QBXL T.T.: Does this trailer come with self-adjusting brakes? If so I'm assuming they don't need to be adjusted?? Thanks,

Mo

Self adjusting... yes... and yes, they do need to be 'adjusted' periodically.
I have 'Forward' adjusting brakes on my camper... meaning, if I push on the brake to hard, too many times, my brakes will lock up the hubs. I know this for a fact as I lost (burned up) one hub and axle on a trip. (Went over The Smokies). The 'rest' of the camper brakes are mostly 'Back ward' adjusting. When you 'back up' and hit the brakes with some good pressure, the brakes will 'ratchet up' and tighten the brake pads. Do this (Forward/Backward) too many times and your brakes are too 'tight' and need to be 'backed off'...... If you do not know how to check the adjustments and settings, have someone who does help you. Too tight brakes are (imo) more dangeress than too loose brakes.

[babock]

I am in the pull the drum camp. I had that exact same issue on a different vehicle once and it was grease contamination. Grease makes brakes very grabby.

[moshe1436]

Originally Posted by babock

I am in the pull the drum camp. I had that exact same issue on a different vehicle once and it was grease contamination. Grease makes brakes very grabby.

Yes, I've had the same problem with hydraulic fluid leaking on the drums and causing grabby brakes! Could be bearing grease too. I'll check that out and another good reason to pull the hubs/drums.

Thanks to all who have chimed in on this.

Mo

[Brother Les]

Originally Posted by moshe1436

Yes, I've had the same problem with hydraulic fluid leaking on the drums and causing grabby brakes! Could be bearing grease too. I'll check that out and another good reason to pull the hubs/drums.

Thanks to all who have chimed in on this.

Mo

If you pull the hubs, you will need to get new seals for the hubs. (You can adjust the brakes and leave the hubs on)

If you pull the hubs, you should remove and inspect and regrease all of the bearings and adjust to spects.

[moshe1436]

Originally Posted by Brother Les

If you pull the hubs, you will need to get new seals for the hubs. (You can adjust the brakes and leave the hubs on)
If you pull the hubs, you should remove and inspect and regrease all of the bearings and adjust to spects.

Yes, I realize that having done all that on my previous boat trailers even though they had hydraulic brakes. Seals are quite critical on boat trailers because of being submerged when using a launch ramp but I know they can wear and allow grease to seep into the brake/drum area on any trailer, submerged or not.

I agree on the bearing repack recommendation too! Thanks!

Mo

[moshe1436]

Today I pulled the drum and checked one brake on the left rear axle. I found some pretty interesting stuff going on. First all there was grease caked on the inside of the shoe backing plates and most all fittings on the inside of the assembly. It looks like the previous owners or mechanics (somebody) forced grease through the axle grease fitting blowing it out through the rear seal, which in turn covered most of the interior of the brake assembly.
See picture 1 (not sure the order of the picture uploads so numbers may not match).

I'm not experienced enough with electric brakes to know if the magnet was worn to the point of being replaced. I left it in because the magnet surface inside the drum seemed fine and hardly worn at all. Pictures are not very clear showing the magnet. See picture 2.

I also noticed a cable connected to the top of the front brake shoe running down behind the back brake shoe and back to where it looks like it attaches to the brake adjustment screw. See picture 3 and 4.

I had to get everything reinstalled before I had to left, so I replaced the rear seal with a new one, repacked the inner and outer bearings which looked fine along with the races and put the drum and everything back together. At that point I thought I'd try to adjust the brakes using a brake spoon by adjusting the star nut on the adjuster pin. But I couldn't find any star nut! It just wasn't there, either through the front or rear openings in the backer plate. Could these brakes have self adjusting brakes with no way to adjust them by turning a star nut on the adjuster (which wasn't there)??

The label on the brake backer plate says 'Made in China, AXLETEX-10-GG (pic 5) The axles are Lippert 3500# (pic 6)

Would appreciate any advice from the folks on this forum. I realize I will have to pull the drum again to do anything else and that's not a problem. Thanks!

[Bama Rambler]

Hopefully you cleaned up all the grease in the area. You were lucky that the brake shoes weren't coated with grease.

You do have self adjusting brakes. The way they adjust is that operates a lever pivoted at an anchor point behind the magnet that turns the star wheel whenever you apply the brakes. Applying the brakes pulls on the cable thereby ratcheting the lever.

That means that you definitely have a star wheel. Now, that star wheel doesn't really line up with the adjustment slots in the backing plate. It may be above or below the slots. (Usually below). The easiest way to reach it is with a brake tool. It has two flat ends that are angled from the middle section. A large flat blade screwdriver can work, but it can be a bit of a pain to get one in the right position to turn the star wheel.

Also, since the self adjusting lever engages the star wheel all the time, you have to push the lever away from the star wheel to adjust it in, loosing the brakes. You can adjust it out without holding the self adjusting lever off, as the star wheel will ratchet by the lever.

[Brother Les]

You should find out if you have forward adjusting brakes or backing up adjusting brakes. If you have forward adjusting brakes and use the 'brakes' too hard, to many times, your brakes will lock/drag on the hub and get everything very hot. Find out which way your brakes auto tighten...

As for the 'grease' everywhere. The person who greased this most likely did it 'on the ground' and did not spin the tires while putting grease in and blowed out the back seal. When you 'cleaned' the hub/spindle area, there is a large gap between the inner and outer bearing. The next time you 'grease' the spindle, (tire off ground) just know that it will take more than half of a tube of grease to fill this void between the two bearings.

[Bama Rambler]

The brakes shown in the pictures adjust in both forward and reverse braking. The magnet arm forces both brake shoes apart whether going forward or backward, and that pulls the adjusting cable which moves the ratchet lever.