Question for those with disc brakes on their trailer

[GreenImp]

Has any of you had a leaking axle/grease seal while running disc brakes? How bad do the pads get hit? Looking at the Kodiak rotors/hubs, it looks like the braking surface might be hollow with channels that MAY allow the majority of grease to drip off without getting too much on the braking surfaces.. just wondering if this is the case or not.

[emm-dee]

Originally Posted by GreenImp

Has any of you had a leaking axle/grease seal while running disc brakes? How bad do the pads get hit? Looking at the Kodiak rotors/hubs, it looks like the braking surface might be hollow with channels that MAY allow the majority of grease to drip off without getting too much on the braking surfaces.. just wondering if this is the case or not.

I installed discs on my previous TH. Never saw any leaking anywhere on the system. About 12,000 miles. Our LQ horse trailer has triple discs and same there…no leaking. Both systems are Titan brand from Performance Trailer Braking.

[GreenImp]

Thank you for the input. Just to clarify, I'm not worried about the brake/hydraulic fluid leaking, but rather am wondering if the disc brakes are less prone to getting soaked in grease when an axle seal fails.



I currently have a 2021 trailer that I just pulled the hubs on to check the bearings for the first time since new and have found all 4 sets of brakes soaked in grease and worthless. Since I have to purchase new brakes all the way around now anyway, I was just considering switching to discs. The additional cost would be a lot easier to swallow if the discs were less prone to this particular grease soaked failure. It seems that at a minimum, a leaky grease seal would be spotted much sooner than it would when hidden inside a drum.

[emm-dee]

Originally Posted by GreenImp

Thank you for the input. Just to clarify, I'm not worried about the brake/hydraulic fluid leaking, but rather am wondering if the disc brakes are less prone to getting soaked in grease when an axle seal fails.



I currently have a 2021 trailer that I just pulled the hubs on to check the bearings for the first time since new and have found all 4 sets of brakes soaked in grease and worthless. Since I have to purchase new brakes all the way around now anyway, I was just considering switching to discs. The additional cost would be a lot easier to swallow if the discs were less prone to this particular grease soaked failure. It seems that at a minimum, a leaky grease seal would be spotted much sooner than it would when hidden inside a drum.

When I installed my discs I had the bearings packed and installed in the hub/rotor by a reputable tire shop. Have never seen any evidence of leaking, but if they did leak I believe it would be immediately noticeable.

[Learjet]

did you use the "ez-lub" zert and pump grease in? If so, that is the problem

[DouglasReid]

Originally Posted by Learjet

did you use the "ez-lub" zert and pump grease in? If so, that is the problem

I was thinking the same thing.

Take the hubs off, clean, repack and reinstall the hubs with new seals and you will NEVER experience a grease seal failure. I do this every spring when I de-winterize the camper. NEVER had a problem.

[Comanchecreek]

Grease seals on disc brakes are the same as grease seals on drum brakes. They all need to be replaced on a regular basis to prevent grease from leaking out of the rear seal. The EZ Lube system is not replaced with the installation of disc brakes. Grease contamination would be less severe with discs probably, but no less important if it happens. The EZ Lube setup is a maintenance item only. Not a replacement for bearing tear down, bearing packing, and "Grease seal replacement". Disc brakes are more of a performance choice, (and a substantial improvement for sure), but your bearing maintenance remains the same.
Just an additional note, you will find the cost of a complete drum brake replacement to be substantially cheaper than a full disc brake conversion if that is an issue for you. Again refer to my comment above about performance.

[SailorSam20500]

I haven't had a grease leak on my setup. From what I read prior to converting, a blown seal will allow grease to get on the back side of the disk and will contaminate the pad on that side. The outside of the disk should remain "pristine" with good braking. So you loose 50% of the braking effort on the bad wheel.

If you run into this, after replacing the seal, you should replace both pads on the brake. The disk can simply be cleaned.

[BMullins46]

One thing that was mentioned in post from Comanchecreek is the replacement of the grease seals, this should be done with every bearing repack and the proper use of the ez-lube (manual grease gun and only a couple of pumps, don't want to fill the hub with grease. Find out the part number for your seals and get a spare set to carry with you.

[BM Welder]

I've had my disk brakes on my Cedar Creek for 3 years now and haven't had any problems with grease leaking.

[FlaNative]

We had our electric brakes replaced with disc brakes about 2 years ago. There is a huge difference in increased braking power: I estimate a 40% decrease in braking distance as opposed to electric brakes, which is huge.
If you convert to disc brakes, make sure that your brake controller has the Electric Over Hydraulic feature built in. The Prodigy P3 has that function and is easy to set up.

I agree with everyone who have their bearings repacked each year. I consider repacking/inspecting brakes a Must Do annually. It's preventative maintenance that could save your life.

[GreenImp]

Originally Posted by SailorSam20500

From what I read prior to converting, a blown seal will allow grease to get on the back side of the disk and will contaminate the pad on that side. The outside of the disk should remain "pristine" with good braking. So you loose 50% of the braking effort on the bad wheel.

This is exactly the kind of information I was looking for... Thank you! Looking at the rotors it's easy to see how the outer side would be pretty well protected against getting grease soaked. It even seems that the inner surface might be somewhat protected by the channels between the braking surfaces.



It would still be nice to hear a firsthand account of how bad the rotors surfaces get soaked when an axle seal fails.

[emm-dee]

Originally Posted by GreenImp

This is exactly the kind of information I was looking for... Thank you! Looking at the rotors it's easy to see how the outer side would be pretty well protected against getting grease soaked. It even seems that the inner surface might be somewhat protected by the channels between the braking surfaces.



It would still be nice to hear a firsthand account of how bad the rotors surfaces get soaked when an axle seal fails.

It appears that no one around here has had experience with seal failure on a disc installation. I’ve heard one of the reasons is the reduced weight of the disc assembly. The only weight on the bearing is the rotor and the tire/wheel. With the antiquated magnetic brakes you have the added weight of the drum, brake shoes, etc. I know I cannot pick up a drum assembly with one hand but picking up the rotor and hub is an easy task.

Another thing to consider is who is doing the install. If the owner is doing the work they are probably much more particular than some individual on an assembly line who is more interested in going home than they are with doing quality work. I’ve done three installs on my units and helped with two others. I only packed one set of bearings which convinced me that’s a messy job best left to a brake specialist.

You also might consider getting in touch with the folks at Performance Trailer Braking. Their customer service is outstanding and I think they would give you accurate information.

[dieselguy]

I've been a mechanic most all my life ... a blown wheel seal is bad news no matter if you have drum or disk brakes. It doesn't matter if theoretically only the back disk pad is greased or both shoes ... you have an issue that needs fixed ASAP as it will only deteriorate farther. I'm going to voice a personal opinion here ... I absolutely do not like to use the EZ Lube grease nipple on the Dexter axles, but I will admit I've made a pile of money off replacing brakes directly attributed to the zerk's misuse. Bill Mullins (and others) ... a couple of pumps using the EZ Lube system is only your personal placebo and does near nothing as to lubrication of the wheel bearings. The entire wheel hub has to be packed with grease for the EZ Lube to work as you are trying to pump grease into and past the rear bearing on thru the hub and out the front bearing while slowly spinning the wheel. I've never ran across a wheel hub straight from the factory that has the entire hub full of grease allowing the system to function as designed. That's why most all of you that have the patience to use the system successfully generally use close to a tube of grease per wheel the first time before you see grease passing thru the outer bearing signaling sucess. Yes, I accept there are a few of you that swear by the EZ Lube system, but like I said, I've made a fair amount of change over the years repairing its failures.

[mnoland30]

Why on earth would a bearing need to be repacked every year? With modern synthetic lubricants, and good seals, those bearings should be fine for years. Do you reseal the bearing on your car axles every year? I don't even change the grease in my boat trailers every year.

Changing disc brakes is much easier than drum brakes.

In my experience, it doesn't make sense to replace the pads without turning the rotor. The grooves in the rotor seem to wear out the pads much faster than smoothly turned rotors.

[emm-dee]

Originally Posted by mnoland30

Why on earth would a bearing need to be repacked every year? With modern synthetic lubricants, and good seals, those bearings should be fine for years. Do you reseal the bearing on your car axles every year? I don't even change the grease in my boat trailers every year.

Changing disc brakes is much easier than drum brakes.

In my experience, it doesn't make sense to replace the pads without turning the rotor. The grooves in the rotor seem to wear out the pads much faster than smoothly turned rotors.

[bubbalowe]

Originally Posted by dieselguy

I've been a mechanic most all my life ... a blown wheel seal is bad news no matter if you have drum or disk brakes. It doesn't matter if theoretically only the back disk pad is greased or both shoes ... you have an issue that needs fixed ASAP as it will only deteriorate farther. I'm going to voice a personal opinion here ... I absolutely do not like to use the EZ Lube grease nipple on the Dexter axles, but I will admit I've made a pile of money off replacing brakes directly attributed to the zerk's misuse. Bill Mullins (and others) ... a couple of pumps using the EZ Lube system is only your personal placebo and does near nothing as to lubrication of the wheel bearings. The entire wheel hub has to be packed with grease for the EZ Lube to work as you are trying to pump grease into and past the rear bearing on thru the hub and out the front bearing while slowly spinning the wheel. I've never ran across a wheel hub straight from the factory that has the entire hub full of grease allowing the system to function as designed. That's why most all of you that have the patience to use the system successfully generally use close to a tube of grease per wheel the first time before you see grease passing thru the outer bearing signaling sucess. Yes, I accept there are a few of you that swear by the EZ Lube system, but like I said, I've made a fair amount of change over the years repairing its failures.

As another retired mechanic I cannot agree more. Hand pump grease guns have the hydraulic pressure to adjust Caterpillar tracks so blowing past that cheezy seal is nothing. The whole theory in Dexter literature of fresh grease being pushed through both bearings from inboard out is a repack is absurd. Most important reason for repack is washing and inspection to catch a failure before it happens but I also don't believe it's necessary yearly. IMHO

[Comanchecreek]

The trouble with EZ Lube system, is that owners think it is a "substitute" for bearing packing and seal maintenance, when in fact it is only a "maintenance" feature to be sure bearings remain greased between tear down. If the bearings are properly packed, and the void between the inner and outer bearing was filled during the tear down, it only takes a few pumps for the grease to push through the front bearing. Assuming (and that is the fatal part of this discussion) the seals have been replaced at proper intervals, no grease should push through and get on the brakes. The statement above that the bearings come from the factory with adequate seals, and properly packed also falls under the "assuming" heading. We all know they use the best of everything when making a trailer, RIGHT?

[jeff64]

Originally Posted by bubbalowe

As another retired mechanic I cannot agree more. Hand pump grease guns have the hydraulic pressure to adjust Caterpillar tracks so blowing past that cheezy seal is nothing. The whole theory in Dexter literature of fresh grease being pushed through both bearings from inboard out is a repack is absurd. Most important reason for repack is washing and inspection to catch a failure before it happens but I also don't believe it's necessary yearly. IMHO

Agreed. If you know what you're doing on the repack and adjustment it's not necessary very often. If you did it yourself, you know which no. 2 grease you're using so compatability isn't an issue. Jack up the wheel, see if there are any abnormal noises, slight brake drag desirable, give it 2-3 pumps of grease as you rotate wheel and let go. Back in the day of repacking vehicle front bearings they were good for 30K miles as long as the weren't submerged in water...

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