Re Tightening Lug Nuts ???

[BBC Cobra]

Original post indicates question is for a class A motorhome, so presuming it is equipped with 22.5” wheels, he is going to need to torque his lug nuts to somewhere in the neighborhood of 480 to 500 lb/ft, that is going to be some torque wrench!

[ArkRVHog]

TandSH...thanks for a good chuckle after overdosing on everything "torque wrench" in this thread!

"Takes about 10 minutes to check torque on all 4 of the 8 lug wheels on our 5er. Remember the parody of the Kenny Rogers song "You Picked a Fine Time to Leave Me Loose Wheel..."

[ArkRVHog]

So the group has me convinced I should own (and know how to properly use) a torque wrench. Can anyone suggest specific tools that would be no more than $100 to get the job done easily and accurately? Thanks!

[BehindBars]

Originally Posted by ArkRVHog

So the group has me convinced I should own (and know how to properly use) a torque wrench. Can anyone suggest specific tools that would be no more than $100 to get the job done easily and accurately? Thanks!

If you’re talking wheel torque, get an electronic torque adapter from Harbor Freight. Assuming you already have or carry a 1/2 inch drive breaker bar to loosen your wheel nuts, just snap this electronic adapter on for measuring the tightening torque. It’s compact and easy to carrying in your vehicle. I compared one to a known calibrated Sturtevant click type torque wrench, and it was very accurate. $30 and you’re all set.

https://www.harborfreight.com/hand-t...ter-63917.html

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by BBC Cobra

Original post indicates question is for a class A motorhome, so presuming it is equipped with 22.5” wheels, he is going to need to torque his lug nuts to somewhere in the neighborhood of 480 to 500 lb/ft, that is going to be some torque wrench!

Or just a smaller torque wrench and using a torque multiplier:



$210 at Northern Tool
https://www.northerntool.com/shop/to...SABEgIOoPD_BwE
The one pictured has a 3:1 gear ratio so 200 Ft lbs of input yields 600 ft/lbs of output torque.

(the "handle" on the multiplier merely rests against a hub, the ground, or other immovable object so the internal gear set has something to react against).

[Bucket-hat Otis]

I want to pop in and post an opinion on this, as I see a lot of posts in this forum about tires and lugs. I've been driving trucks for 21 years and I want to share a little about how this works in the trucking industry.



It is impossible for every driver to check every lug on every tire. What most drivers do, not all - but many, is look for signs and pound the tires with a thumper. Pounding the tires is quick and it will reveal the worst inflation problems. The signs I referto is on lugs and wheels and spindle bearings. Look for oil or grease on the wheels, inside and out. Look for rust on lugs or missing lugs. Look for rusty wheels. If something doesn't look right or SMELL right, check more thoroughly, catch as many problems as you can in a reasonable time frame.


If you have the means and desire to check torque specs on all your lugs, by all means go for it and thank you. The more often the better, because temperature, weather, wear, salt, etc are all factors that can change lug conditions. But, don't think that just because you do this that you are eliminating risk. There is always risk, and the biggest risk are the other millions of people on the road around you. Ultimately, the biggest factor is reducing that risk, plan trips wisely. If you don't have to travel, don't. If you do desire or need to travel, then try to avoid congestion. Keep it in the back of your mind, can I do something to reduce my risk? For example, I could go to walmart at 3:30 in the afternoon when everybody else in the working world also goes, or I could go at 5:00am when pretty much everyone else is in bed. Think.......

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by jeffnick

Trailer wheels and hubs are not made to the same specs as people vehicles.

If you have a FWD vehicle from the late 80's and early 90's with drum brakes on the rear axle, the hubs and wheels are almost exactly the same if the drums are removable without removing the bearings.

The change came with disc brakes.

[ArkRVHog]

Originally Posted by BehindBars

If you’re talking wheel torque, get an electronic torque adapter from Harbor Freight. Assuming you already have or carry a 1/2 inch drive breaker bar to loosen your wheel nuts, just snap this electronic adapter on for measuring the tightening torque. It’s compact and easy to carrying in your vehicle. I compared one to a known calibrated Sturtevant click type torque wrench, and it was very accurate. $30 and you’re all set.

https://www.harborfreight.com/hand-t...ter-63917.html

Thanks BehindBars....so the breaker bar is used IF you were going to remove the nuts for tire change...not necessary to use with the torque monitor, right? I've read in these postings that if you loosen your lugs specifically to then re-torque you now need to check them again in 10-50-100 miles to make sure they have stay put. (I really don't want any additional efforts if possible.)

Am I missing something here? Thx.

[BehindBars]

Originally Posted by ArkRVHog

Thanks BehindBars....so the breaker bar is used IF you were going to remove the nuts for tire change...not necessary to use with the torque monitor, right? I've read in these postings that if you loosen your lugs specifically to then re-torque you now need to check them again in 10-50-100 miles to make sure they have stay put. (I really don't want any additional efforts if possible.)

Am I missing something here? Thx.

The point of buying the electronic adapter is you don’t need to buy and carry a whole ‘nother wrench. I already carried a 2 foot, 1/2 inch drive breaker bar and sockets to change wheels on my class C. So now I just added the torque adapter to the kit to be used only when tightening the wheel nuts.

I have other various size torque wrenches at home for repairs and maintenance, but the little electronic adapter is great for portability.

[Oaklevel]

Guess that I need to get a torque wrench now........

Just off track side note my first car with factory front disc brakes is my 1966 the first I owned with factory discs all the way around is my 1986.

[mharrel]

Want to find out how much over-torque? Just reverse the ratchet on the torque wrench and see how much torque it takes to remove the lug nut. You might be shocked.[/QUOTE]

Chances are you WILL be shocked. I never trust ham fisted guys with impact wrenches at tire shops. Anytime I have any tire changes done, I go home and loosen the lugs and retorque them. They are almost always overtorqued. Several times I have found them tightened to over 150 lbs--that's as high as my torque wrench goes. I have to use a cheater bar to get them off. At home, I have a cheater bar. At the side of the road, I don't.

[aircommuter]

First many torque wrenches say in the manual not to use them for removing fasteners.
Second removing a fastener doesn’t tell you how much torque was used to install it because you have to overcome the friction to get it moving.
Torquing of fasteners is measured when they are in motion then stop.

[BehindBars]

Originally Posted by mharrel

Chances are you WILL be shocked. I never trust ham fisted guys with impact wrenches at tire shops. Anytime I have any tire changes done, I go home and loosen the lugs and retorque them. They are almost always overtorqued. Several times I have found them tightened to over 150 lbs--that's as high as my torque wrench goes. I have to use a cheater bar to get them off. At home, I have a cheater bar. At the side of the road, I don't.

Allowing shops to over tighten the lug nut, then later using a torque wrench to correctly set the torque yourself sounds like a bad general practice. With each overtorque episode, I would expect the studs, nuts, and the wheel to likely be damaged. My practice is to simply not allow anyone to tighten the lug nuts but me. That way I know they never were over torqued and potentially damaged.

I change tires myself now most all of the time. If I do use a shop to mount tire(s), I take in the wheel(s) only, never the whole vehicle.

[mharrel]

I change tires myself now most all of the time. If I do use a shop to mount tire(s), I take in the wheel(s) only, never the whole vehicle.[/QUOTE]

I generally do that as well. However, when I'm buying a whole set of tires, I get lazy. You're more dedicated than I.

[gordonsick]

Originally Posted by mharrel

Want to find out how much over-torque? Just reverse the ratchet on the torque wrench and see how much torque it takes to remove the lug nut. You might be shocked.

Chances are you WILL be shocked. I never trust ham fisted guys with impact wrenches at tire shops. Anytime I have any tire changes done, I go home and loosen the lugs and retorque them. They are almost always overtorqued. Several times I have found them tightened to over 150 lbs--that's as high as my torque wrench goes. I have to use a cheater bar to get them off. At home, I have a cheater bar. At the side of the road, I don't.[/QUOTE]

The torque to loosen the nut will always be higher than the torque to tighten the nut, so this is not a reliable indication of over-torquing.

The reason for this is that the coefficient of standing friction is higher than the coefficient of sliding friction. It takes more force to start sliding an object (standing) friction than it does to continue sliding the object (sliding friction).

When you back off the wheel nuts, you are starting with standing friction. When you tighten a wheel nut, the threads are sliding and present less friction.

–Gordon

[SailorSam20500]

Originally Posted by TandSH

That type of torque wrench should NOT be left set to a moderate to high setting NOR be reset to zero. Either can (most likely will) result in the calibration becoming inaccurate.

For storage reset the wrench adjustment to approximately 10 to 15 percent of the rating of the wrench. So for a wrench rated up to 150 lb-ft, set it to about 15 to 20 lb-ft and be sure to keep it clean, out of the weather and don't drop it.

I just checked the instruction guide on my home click wrench. It states: "When finished, set the Torque to the lowest setting (not lower than the lowest setting) before storing...". On this wrench the lowest setting is zero.

When all else fails, read the instructions.

[jenandjon]

Originally Posted by BBC Cobra

Original post indicates question is for a class A motorhome, so presuming it is equipped with 22.5” wheels, he is going to need to torque his lug nuts to somewhere in the neighborhood of 480 to 500 lb/ft, that is going to be some torque wrench!

If I have have to change a tire on the rig I have a inch socket set and a 3 foot cheater bar. I weigh 230 pounds so multiply that to the length of the for mentioned cheater bar and carry the 1 That should torque it down to....I have no idea but enough to get to a shop.

[gordonsick]

Freightliner recommends a nut-tightening order that goes from side to side, rather than sequentially around the wheel. This procedure is discussed in earlier posts to this thread. I attach Page 40/1 of the Freightliner Maintenance Manual for 2011 on this matter. Also, the best practice is to not tighten the nut with an impact wrench.

So, I watched with interest as my local tire dealer re-installed my wheels after I bought some new tires. Two different technicians did the installation. Both of them started with an impact wrench and followed up with a heavy click-type torque wrench. When they used the torque wrench, it immediately clicked and I couldn't see the nut move. That means that more than enough torque was supplied by the impact wrench.

One of the technicians started the impact wrench with a top nut, then a bottom nut, then back to the top, one nut over and the same with the bottom. The other did the top and then a bottom and then proceeded in a circle around the wheel. Neither of these resembled the Freightliner pattern.

It will be interesting to see if I turn the nuts any more when I check the tightness myself in the standard follow-up.

I doubt that my installers were that unusual in not doing things by the book.

–Gordon

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by gordonsick

Freightliner recommends a nut-tightening order that goes from side to side, rather than sequentially around the wheel. This procedure is discussed in earlier posts to this thread. I attach Page 40/1 of the Freightliner Maintenance Manual for 2011 on this matter. Also, the best practice is to not tighten the nut with an impact wrench.

So, I watched with interest as my local tire dealer re-installed my wheels after I bought some new tires. Two different technicians did the installation. Both of them started with an impact wrench and followed up with a heavy click-type torque wrench. When they used the torque wrench, it immediately clicked and I couldn't see the nut move. That means that more than enough torque was supplied by the impact wrench.

One of the technicians started the impact wrench with a top nut, then a bottom nut, then back to the top, one nut over and the same with the bottom. The other did the top and then a bottom and then proceeded in a circle around the wheel. Neither of these resembled the Freightliner pattern.

It will be interesting to see if I turn the nuts any more when I check the tightness myself in the standard follow-up.

I doubt that my installers were that unusual in not doing things by the book.

–Gordon

What you described exists in way too many tire service facilities all over the country. For over 17 years it was my part of my job to combat this practice in our stores. Unless the service area has video camera's installed that monitor every wheel installation, tire techs will continue to shortcut just like you observed.

I can honestly say that the Dealer I use is constantly watching his employees and they do it right. At least all the times I've observed. The dealer's philosophy is that customers are too valuable to p** off because one of his tire guys was too lazy, or too big a hurry to do it right.

Another old saying: "Why is it you never have time to do it right but you can always find time to do it over again".

BTW, there may be a solution on the horizon. NASCAR is going to a "single nut" wheel system. It may make it's way to the automotive and light truck market. I used to have a 1956 MGA Roadster that had just one nut. Was great. No problems lining the wheel up with 4 or 5 studs.