Tire rotation issue with Beyond/Transit 350HD AWD Dually

[Frans]

My Ford owner's manual tells me to rotate tires when changing oil using the so-called cross-rotation approach: left front to right front, right front to left front, left rear pair to right rear, right rear pair to left rear. Ford dealer doesn't agree. They say this method may cause tire blow-out of the dually rear tires because of potential stresses/wear in those tires. They say as a rule they don't rotate tires at all on dually vehicles.
Tires have been confirmed by Hankook to be multi-directional (fine to spin in both directions) and should be fine for cross-rotate. Ford Co. confirmed method in the owner's manual is correct.

Ford dealer told me that if I wanted to rotate the tires that they would use a method of rotating the three left tires, either clockwise or counterclockwise and the three right tires similarly, without crossing them over to the other side. It involves removing all tires from their hubs and rebalancing afterwards (the hubs would stay in the same position). They would charge me only $120. Furthermore, they told me that it wasn't really necessary to rotate my tires because the advantages of doing that are doubtful for dually vehicles in their opinion.

Have any of you run into this issue and what can you advise me? Should I just forget about rotating and if not, how to resolve this conflict between what the Ford Motor Co. tells me and what the dealer tells me?

[Sunseeker16]

Right or wrong, if my wear pattern looks good I ain't touching them.

[kenandterry]

I keep an eye on all my tires quite regularly.

Didn’t rotate them on the Georgetown and don’t plan on rotating them on the Sunseeker.

Suit yourself.

[wmtire]

Originally Posted by Frans

My Ford owner's manual tells me to rotate tires when changing oil using the so-called cross-rotation approach: left front to right front, right front to left front, left rear pair to right rear, right rear pair to left rear. Ford dealer doesn't agree. They say this method may cause tire blow-out of the dually rear tires because of potential stresses/wear in those tires. They say as a rule they don't rotate tires at all on dually vehicles.
Tires have been confirmed by Hankook to be multi-directional (fine to spin in both directions) and should be fine for cross-rotate. Ford Co. confirmed method in the owner's manual is correct.

Ford dealer told me that if I wanted to rotate the tires that they would use a method of rotating the three left tires, either clockwise or counterclockwise and the three right tires similarly, without crossing them over to the other side. It involves removing all tires from their hubs and rebalancing afterwards (the hubs would stay in the same position). They would charge me only $120. Furthermore, they told me that it wasn't really necessary to rotate my tires because the advantages of doing that are doubtful for dually vehicles in their opinion.

Have any of you run into this issue and what can you advise me? Should I just forget about rotating and if not, how to resolve this conflict between what the Ford Motor Co. tells me and what the dealer tells me?

When you say "hub", I assume you mean the rim the tire is mounted on?


The problem you may encounter with duallys is that the two tires that are side by side on the rear, need to be real close to the same treadwear, so one tire is not taller than the other and is carrying more of the load than the tire beside it.


When you start rotating them, then one of the tires from the front is going to end up on the rear with another one, that was already there.... and there may be a difference in height depending on the wear and how long you waited to rotate..


However $120 is a real good price to dismount, remount, and balance 6 dually tires.

[Chuck_S]

Tire rotation's only purpose is to distribute wear. If they're wearing evenly there's no point in rotating them. If they're non-directional (no rotation arrow on the sidewall) just swap them side to side pretending the dually rear set is just a single big wide tire.

-- Chuck

[BehindBars]

Can someone explain what the dealer’s reason is behind rotating only the tires and leaving the rims in the original place, vs rotating the entire rim/tire assemblies? Are the front rims on a Transit dually not the same as the rear rims? On my E-450 DRW, all six rims are the same (seven if I count the spare wheel), and it makes no difference what position the rims are in.

[wmtire]

Originally Posted by BehindBars

Can someone explain what the dealer’s reason is behind rotating only the tires and leaving the rims in the original place, vs rotating the entire rim/tire assemblies? Are the front rims on a Transit dually not the same as the rear rims? On my E-450 DRW, all six rims are the same (seven if I count the spare wheel), and it makes no difference what position the rims are in.

If they are aluminum, it does make a difference. The inside duals may be steel rims, while the outside duals are aluminum with the clean shiny side facing outwards on these reversed mounted wheels. Then the front rims will have the clean side on the outside but the rim is mounted the same as the inside duals.

You basically do have to dismount and remount all the tires since really all the aluminum wheels on one side are specific to their location.

I have many a customer take a pass on rotating their duallys when it gets explained the time and cost to do it with their aluminum wheels.

Looking at the webpage pic for the Beyond/Transit, it does show aluminum wheels and says such in the specifications:

FORD OEM forged aluminum wheels

https://coachmenrv.com/class-b-motorhomes/beyond

[BehindBars]

Originally Posted by wmtire

If they are aluminum, it does make a difference. The inside duals may be steel rims, while the outside duals are aluminum with the clean shiny side facing outwards on these reversed mounted wheels. Then the front rims will have the clean side on the outside but the rim is mounted the same as the inside duals.

You basically do have to dismount and remount all the tires since really all the aluminum wheels on one side are specific to their location.

I have many a customer take a pass on rotating their duallys when it gets explained the time and cost to do it with their aluminum wheels.

Looking at the webpage pic for the Beyond/Transit, it does show aluminum wheels.

https://coachmenrv.com/class-b-motorhomes/beyond

Ok, I looked up a photo of the Beyond motorhome, and that makes sense if all six rims are not the same. I remember shopping for a Class C a few years ago, and a Winnebago model had an aluminum rim option. I asked if all 6 rims were aluminum and I was told that only 4 were aluminum. I thought right then and there that was going to be trouble. I did not buy the coach, but if I had, I would not have taken that option.

This should be a lesson for anyone thinking of buying a dually with 2 steel and 4 aluminum rims.

[wmtire]

Originally Posted by BehindBars

Ok, that makes sense if all six rims are not the same. I remember shopping for a Class C a few years ago, and a Winnebago model had an aluminum rim option. I asked if all 6 rims were aluminum and I was told that only 4 were aluminum. I thought right then and there that was going to be trouble. I did not buy the coach, but if I had, I would not have taken that option.

This should be a lesson for anyone thinking of buying a dually with only 4 aluminum rims.

It really doesn't matter even if it's six aluminums. It doesn't take long at all for road dirt, grime, and brake dust to really muss up the rims. You will find out that you can never clean the fronts, or the inside duals enough to place either wheel on the outside dual position and have it look shiny/clean.

The inside dual get's filthy, pitted and mussed up just from it's location, and usually can't be put on front or outside rear.

The outside dual, even though clean/shiny on the reverse side showing, is getting scratched/ mussed up on the side that is bolted up against the inside dual, so you don't want it put on the front after you flip it around.

The front wheel gets all kind of mussed up on the inside (usually brake dust/grease) that they now cannot be put on the outside duals. And after the first time as an inside dual, you have the same problem as the original inside dual.

If you want it to look good, you really need to leave all six wheels in their original location and swap the tires off/on the rims.

The Ford dealer told the OP correct.

Next time a dually is in the shop for a rear tire repair/replacement with aluminum wheels, I will take a pic to show all of this.

[BehindBars]

That all makes sense, wmtire. Thanks for the explanation.

No aluminum dually for me.

[5picker]

Originally Posted by Frans

My Ford owner's manual tells me to rotate tires when changing oil using the so-called cross-rotation approach: left front to right front, right front to left front, left rear pair to right rear, right rear pair to left rear. Ford dealer doesn't agree. They say this method may cause tire blow-out of the dually rear tires because of potential stresses/wear in those tires. They say as a rule they don't rotate tires at all on dually vehicles.
Tires have been confirmed by Hankook to be multi-directional (fine to spin in both directions) and should be fine for cross-rotate. Ford Co. confirmed method in the owner's manual is correct.

Ford dealer told me that if I wanted to rotate the tires that they would use a method of rotating the three left tires, either clockwise or counterclockwise and the three right tires similarly, without crossing them over to the other side. It involves removing all tires from their hubs and rebalancing afterwards (the hubs would stay in the same position). They would charge me only $120. Furthermore, they told me that it wasn't really necessary to rotate my tires because the advantages of doing that are doubtful for dually vehicles in their opinion.

Have any of you run into this issue and what can you advise me? Should I just forget about rotating and if not, how to resolve this conflict between what the Ford Motor Co. tells me and what the dealer tells me?

I don't agree with this statement by the dealer but with that said... $120 to rotate and rebalance the tires the way they would do it is a steal.

Most places wouldn't rotate them the way the OP wanted to do it (per the manual) for that money.

[BehindBars]

Ford owner’s manual may not agree with dealer advice because the aluminum rims are possibly not OEM, rather were fitted aftermarket as part of the motorhome build.

As for the blow out theory, I regularly rotated tires on my old DRW class C, mixing fronts with duals. I guess I got really lucky as I never had a blow out and the tires lasted nearly 15 years.

[Reverse_snowbird]

Ford is giving you information about the tire rotation for their van.
The dealer is giving you their recommendation for your motorhome.
The vehicles are different so the advice is different. The load on the tires is different because it's now a motorhome so rotation might not be advisable.

[Chuck_S]

$120 to rotate and rebalance the tires the way they would do it is a steal.

Dealer is stealing unless this is necessary which seems unlikely. Next they'll want to put special nitrogen in the tires.

-- Chuck

[Chaplain Kent]

I always buy my tires at Discount Tire. They give me a free balance and rotation for the life of the tire.

[BehindBars]

Originally Posted by Chaplain Kent

I always buy my tires at Discount Tire. They give me a free balance and rotation for the life of the tire.

That’s nice for the E-450, but staying with the thread discussion, how does Discount Tire handle DRW vehicle tire rotations if 4 rims are aluminum and 2 are steel, or if all 6 rims are aluminum?

[Chuck_S]

They give me a free balance and rotation for the life of the tire.

No free lunch. You paid for that service in advance.

-- Chuck

[LittleBill]

Originally Posted by wmtire

It really doesn't matter even if it's six aluminums. It doesn't take long at all for road dirt, grime, and brake dust to really muss up the rims. You will find out that you can never clean the fronts, or the inside duals enough to place either wheel on the outside dual position and have it look shiny/clean.

The inside dual get's filthy, pitted and mussed up just from it's location, and usually can't be put on front or outside rear.

The outside dual, even though clean/shiny on the reverse side showing, is getting scratched/ mussed up on the side that is bolted up against the inside dual, so you don't want it put on the front after you flip it around.

The front wheel gets all kind of mussed up on the inside (usually brake dust/grease) that they now cannot be put on the outside duals. And after the first time as an inside dual, you have the same problem as the original inside dual.

If you want it to look good, you really need to leave all six wheels in their original location and swap the tires off/on the rims.

The Ford dealer told the OP correct.

Next time a dually is in the shop for a rear tire repair/replacement with aluminum wheels, I will take a pic to show all of this.

My dealer has also recommended not to rotate the 6 tires on my 2021 Chevy 3500HD DRW due to the same situation pointed out about the 4 aluminum and 2 steel rims by wmtire. I have 15,000 miles and haven't had any problems so far.

Be safe -

[nvallerga]

When I worked in a tire shop in the 1980's, on dual rear wheel sets, we would put the slightly more worn tires on the insides. This would compensate for the curvature of the road surface. Not sure if it is practiced now.

[NMWildcat]

We never rotate any of the duallys we have. Rear tires wear evenly and we replace the fronts as needed, usually about twice before the rears need it, depending on the load.