RV News RVBusiness 2021 Top 10 RVs of the Year, plus 56 additional debuts and must-see units → ×


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-05-2020, 08:24 PM   #1
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 12
No AC power, DC OK in T21DMHW

Moved the A-frame up to the house today to begin winterizing, plugged it in, and found an electrical problem. As far as I can tell, DC power and wiring are all good. Battery is charging and DC devices all run. But there’s no AC power to any of the outlets or appliances. Checked the breakers and fuses with no luck (edit: also reset the GFI, which was tripped, with no change). Examined the wiring in the bench seat behind the panel and didn’t notice anything obvious. Converter is the factory WF-8735P from 2018. Is it possible for them to fail in this way? If so, time to look at replacements? Thanks in advance.
GM80 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2020, 08:30 PM   #2
World Traveler Member
 
abdiver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Santa Rosa
Posts: 171
Quote:
Originally Posted by GM80 View Post
Moved the A-frame up to the house today to begin winterizing, plugged it in, and found an electrical problem. As far as I can tell, DC power and wiring are all good. Battery is charging and DC devices all run. But thereís no AC power to any of the outlets or appliances. Checked the breakers and fuses with no luck. Examined the wiring in the bench seat behind the panel and didnít notice anything obvious. Converter is the factory WF-8735P from 2018. Is it possible for them to fail in this way? If so, time to look at replacements? Thanks in advance.
Did you check your GFI by your power station, just push the button?
__________________
2014 A194HW
2004 Toyota 4runner V8 4WD
abdiver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2020, 10:02 PM   #3
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by abdiver View Post
Did you check your GFI by your power station, just push the button?
Thanks for asking, forgot to mention that. Yes I did. It was tripped but resetting it didn’t change the situation. It did not immediately fault again.
GM80 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2020, 06:20 AM   #4
Head Rambler
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Southwest Alabama
Posts: 8,628
Since the converter is working and the GFCI reset that means that power is getting to the RV.

Is there power at the GFCI? There should be since it reset, even if maybe just on one of receptacles? If it reset and there's no power at it, then I'd suspect a bad GFCI.
__________________
Salem 29RKSS Pushing a GMC Sierra 2500HD!
Gotta go campin!
Bama Rambler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2020, 02:03 AM   #5
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bama Rambler View Post
Is there power at the GFCI? There should be since it reset, even if maybe just on one of receptacles? If it reset and there's no power at it, then I'd suspect a bad GFCI.
No power in either GFCI receptacle. I'm no electrician, but also no VAC present in the wiring behind the GFCI outlet as far as my meter shows. Will unhook from shore power and swap the outlet anyway, as it's some cheap plastic crap that gives me the willies (not to mention the two different types of fasteners the factory used do hold it onto the box... one's a coarse thread wood screw). Will update. Thanks.
__________________
2019 Flagstaff T21DMHW
2014 Chevrolet Silverado 1500 5.3/3.42
GM80 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2020, 09:10 AM   #6
Head Rambler
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Southwest Alabama
Posts: 8,628
If there's no power to the GFCI then it shouldn't have reset. Most all the GFCI's I've dealt with have to have power in order for the reset button to work.
__________________
Salem 29RKSS Pushing a GMC Sierra 2500HD!
Gotta go campin!
Bama Rambler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2020, 09:18 AM   #7
Site Team
 
Flybob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 12,185
How did you determine the battery is charging? Please check the power at the house outlet where you have the RV plugged in. If the circuit is protected by a GFCI in the house, it is possible that the circuit is not live. We have seen instances where two GFCIs in series do not work well. The GFCI is an electrical device and requires AC power to reset so without power pushing the reset does nothing. Start at the house outlet. Then using a meter check the RV end of the power cord. It is very likely this is not an RV issue.
__________________

2015 Freedom Express 248RBS
TV 2015 Silverado HD2500 Duramax
TST Tire Monitors
Honda 2000I + Companion
2 100W solar panels
Flybob is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2020, 10:57 AM   #8
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bama Rambler View Post
If there's no power to the GFCI then it shouldn't have reset. Most all the GFCI's I've dealt with have to have power in order for the reset button to work.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flybob View Post
The GFCI is an electrical device and requires AC power to reset so without power pushing the reset does nothing.
Noted, thank you. Always happy to learn something new.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Flybob View Post
How did you determine the battery is charging? Please check the power at the house outlet where you have the RV plugged in. If the circuit is protected by a GFCI in the house, it is possible that the circuit is not live. Start at the house outlet. Then using a meter check the RV end of the power cord. It is very likely this is not an RV issue.

The camper had been stored (unintentionally) since March, so power vampires had completely drained the battery. When I went to retrieve it, the power tongue jack, roof lift, and clock radio were completely inoperable. I cranked it up by hand and connected it to the house. They were still inoperable at first, but slowly came back to life and are now working fine (like the rest of the 12V gear). I have made the assumption that they're running on a now-charged battery.

The house outlet is an outdoor 30A run by an electrician last year. As far as I know, it goes directly from a dedicated 30A breaker to the outlet on the exterior wall with no GFCI involved. We used it successfully several times before March. I will also begin with a cable check as you suggested, though. Seems like a logical starting place.

Thanks for your input, folks.
__________________
2019 Flagstaff T21DMHW
2014 Chevrolet Silverado 1500 5.3/3.42
GM80 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2020, 11:22 AM   #9
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Posts: 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by GM80 View Post
The camper had been stored (unintentionally) since March, so power vampires had completely drained the battery.
Always disconnect your battery when stored. Deep cycle batteries donít like to be fully drained.
PapaGlenn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-09-2020, 01:16 PM   #10
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 2,403
Quote:
Originally Posted by GM80 View Post
The camper had been stored (unintentionally) since March, so power vampires had completely drained the battery. When I went to retrieve it, the power tongue jack, roof lift, and clock radio were completely inoperable. I cranked it up by hand and connected it to the house. They were still inoperable at first, but slowly came back to life and are now working fine (like the rest of the 12V gear). I have made the assumption that they're running on a now-charged battery.
Chances are the dead battery is still dead, and the converter is running your 12V bus. The WFCO converter will often blow the 30A battery fuse on the panel if the battery is below 10V, instead of charging the battery. That's what happened to me. Check all your fuses on the panel, and the resettable 12V circuit breaker on the underside of the left tongue beam.
Quote:
The house outlet is an outdoor 30A run by an electrician last year. As far as I know, it goes directly from a dedicated 30A breaker to the outlet on the exterior wall with no GFCI involved. We used it successfully several times before March. I will also begin with a cable check as you suggested, though. Seems like a logical starting place.
By code in most areas, outside outlets have to be GFCI protected. The GFCI can be at the outlet (unlikely for 30A) or at the circuit breaker in your house panel (more likely).

The ONLY AC appliance on an A-frame that runs without DC power is the microwave. A quick check of the microwave clock tells me if I have AC power coming into the camper.

If you have AC power to the A-frame (voltage check on the power cord), then check all your circuit breakers on the panel. The left breaker is the master breaker for the AC input. But I do believe you have AC coming in because the converter is powered. Which likely leads back to a GFCI issue because the outlets are not powered.

Fred W
2019 Flagstaff T21TBHW A-frame
2008 Hyundai Entourage minivan
camping Colorado and adjacent states one weekend at a time
pgandw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-10-2020, 11:13 AM   #11
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 12
Final update, hopefully, as I have a reliable solutionÖ but I'm still not sure what's happening.

I started from the in-house breaker and worked my way through each component step by step. There is no GFCI on the outdoor 30A circuit (although there is one on an outdoor 20A installed at the same timeómaybe that's our local code?).

I discovered that if I shut off the 30A outlet at the breaker, then connect the RV, then bring the power back online, everything works fine. AC appliances ran all night with no issues.

If there's already power to the 30A outlet when I connect, though, the RV GFCI trips and there's no AC power inside (as described in the original post) ó even after resetting the GFCI and toggling the RV breakers. I have to toggle the house breaker to get the RV to "recognize" it.

Like I said, no idea what that means but I'll just connect things in the "correct" order from now on. Thanks for everyone's input.
__________________
2019 Flagstaff T21DMHW
2014 Chevrolet Silverado 1500 5.3/3.42
GM80 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-10-2020, 11:20 AM   #12
Site Team
 
Flybob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 12,185
Are you sure that the house 30A circuit breaker is not a GFCI breaker?
__________________

2015 Freedom Express 248RBS
TV 2015 Silverado HD2500 Duramax
TST Tire Monitors
Honda 2000I + Companion
2 100W solar panels
Flybob is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-10-2020, 11:27 AM   #13
OYO
Senior Member
 
OYO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: SW Ohio
Posts: 781
With your last post I'm suspicious of your 30 amp line (but I'm no expert).

Do you have a 30 amp to 15 amp adapter aka dogbone?

https://www.etrailer.com/RV-Plug-Ada...0-1530HVP.html

Just curious if the camper behaves the same using your 20 amp line.

You don't really need 30 except to run the heatpump.
__________________
2016 Rockwood A213HW
2019 GMC Sierra Crew Cab Denali 6.2

Craig
OYO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-10-2020, 11:33 AM   #14
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flybob View Post
Are you sure that the house 30A circuit breaker is not a GFCI breaker?
There is no test/reset button on either the breaker or the outlet. It looks like every other standard breaker in the panel. As it's a straight dedicated run between the two, I'm not sure what I could be overlooking.


Quote:
Originally Posted by OYO View Post
Do you have a 30 amp to 15 amp adapter aka dogbone? Just curious if the camper behaves the same using your 20 amp line.
I do and I used it for "everything but heatpump" prior to having the 30A line installed. Will try it later to see whether the same issue is present.

Thanks folks
__________________
2019 Flagstaff T21DMHW
2014 Chevrolet Silverado 1500 5.3/3.42
GM80 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-10-2020, 12:17 PM   #15
Head Rambler
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Southwest Alabama
Posts: 8,628
Sounds like the RV GFCI trips when you "plug" the power cord into the 30 amp receptacle with power applied, and then isn't actually resetting when you press the button.

Have you ever checked the receptacle to make sure the Hot and Neutral aren't switched?
Did you replace the GFCI in the RV?
Have you checked the shore power cord ends and receptacle for loose connections?
Does the blades or slots in the plug/receptacle look burnt or like they've been hot?
__________________
Salem 29RKSS Pushing a GMC Sierra 2500HD!
Gotta go campin!
Bama Rambler is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
power

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Forest River, Inc. or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:08 PM.