Roof actuator replacement

[ccamper]

Originally Posted by LafIN

There is a new Warranty Administrator , her name is Rayna Dimitross
Same phone # 574-642-8944. She was great, sent a new actuator when I called her to tell her ours was dead. Also when you call be sure to have the last 7 #’s of your VIN to prove which unit you have.

What model year is your A frame?

[Sampen]

What kind of grommet? I'm going on my 3rd lift arm they just fill with water. 3rd one is on way.
Thanks sam

QUOTE=OYO;1776641]I find this amusing. They've decided to make it easier to replace the actuators when (not if) they fail.

On another note: I'm convinced it's all about waterproofing. On my 3rd one I sprayed the motor with flexseal and made a grommet like thing to keep the water from running down the shaft into the motor housing.

No issues over a year later.[/QUOTE]

[pgandw]

Has anyone had experience with replacing the factory gas struts that help lift the roof on the 2019+ models? As my lift motor needs more and more assistance to get the roof up, I took a careful lift at the gas struts the factory installed. I suspect the struts are no longer providing the lift assist they once did. The lift motor is still functional but now stalls out much easier moving the roof up.

The factory-installed struts I have are apparently made by/for a company called LaVanture in Elkhart, Indiana - that's where my web browser was redirected when I put in the www.liftsprings.co that was printed on the struts. LaVanture's web site shows a catalog from 2012, and not much else!

Regardless, the pdf catalog showed their part numbering nomenclature - which agreed with my measurements and the printing on the struts. I have 2 different part numbers for the 2 struts (typical for Forest River) - GN10-360-40 and GN10-334-40XX. The 360 and 334 indicate 2 different extended lengths 33.4" and 36.0". 10mm is the shaft diameter, and 40 is the pressure. Actual extended length is 36" with roof up, compressed length is 22" with roof fully down. Both struts have ball mounts, but different ball retention fittings on the strut itself.

The struts appear to be mounted at the same point where OYO's friend suggested, and OYO mounted his struts.

If anybody has any further insight on the original gas strut install, I'm all ears. Without any further info on the original install, I will be looking to replace with 60PSI struts.

Just as an aside, there are 4 struts to lift the dormer roof and dormer front into place - these work great. A gentle push on each part of the dormer, and the struts put the part into place. I then pull the dormer roof down to the front window section and latch - exactly the way struts should work. I want to replicate the success with the roof.

Will probably order a replacement lift motor, too - but I think the struts are the key to keeping the motor working. The lift motor on my 2019 is mounted at the bottom and geared at the bottom of the lift. The top has colored plastic seals, and the whole lift plugs into an electrical socket for easier replacement. Being in Colorado, my A-frame does not get exposed to a lot of rain.

2019 Flagstaff T21TBHW A-frame
2008 Hyundai Entourage minivan
camping Colorado and adjacent states one weekend at a time

[OYO]

The only thing I'd worry about with the 60s (that's what I use) is it may be putting
preasure on the actuator during the down cycle that it may not be engineered for.

With mine I have to pull down on the rear panel to get it to close all the way. But your roof is heavier, I don't have the dormer.

I'd buy the 60s. If the damn thing poops out toss it in the trash and never look back.

I really like this site

https://www.siraweb.com/gas-props-19...5&pageNumber=1

I've used them for several projects. They seem to have good prices, pretty quick delivery and I really like the way you can filter on the left panel to drill down to what you want.

But I didn't see a 33.4. Might be hard to find.

Good luck.

[pgandw]

I'm convinced the 33.4 is an installation error by Forest River, and may be one of the reasons the struts aren't providing enough support. I measure 36" when the roof is up, which means the 33.4 is too short. I still can't believe - well, yes I can - that FR installed 2 different gas struts on the roof lift.

I called liftsupportsdepot.com, and found out I needed further info like the compressed length, the end configuration, and that they couldn't cross reference the numbers I had. Which led me to research the installed struts, and find out the struts came from LaVanture (based in Elkhart, IN), who has very out-of-date documentation on their web site (seems all-too-typical for Forest River and Elkhart). But liftsupportsdepot.com seemed very interested in helping me.

I just wondered if anybody else had roof assist gas struts on their A-frame from the factory, and whether or not they worked. Or did I get a one-off prototype?

Fred W

[Zoinks]

Originally Posted by pgandw

Has anyone had experience with replacing the factory gas struts that help lift the roof on the 2019+ models? As my lift motor needs more and more assistance to get the roof up, I took a careful lift at the gas struts the factory installed. I suspect the struts are no longer providing the lift assist they once did. The lift motor is still functional but now stalls out much easier moving the roof up.

The factory-installed struts I have are apparently made by/for a company called LaVanture in Elkhart, Indiana - that's where my web browser was redirected when I put in the www.liftsprings.co that was printed on the struts. LaVanture's web site shows a catalog from 2012, and not much else!

Regardless, the pdf catalog showed their part numbering nomenclature - which agreed with my measurements and the printing on the struts. I have 2 different part numbers for the 2 struts (typical for Forest River) - GN10-360-40 and GN10-334-40XX. The 360 and 334 indicate 2 different extended lengths 33.4" and 36.0". 10mm is the shaft diameter, and 40 is the pressure. Actual extended length is 36" with roof up, compressed length is 22" with roof fully down. Both struts have ball mounts, but different ball retention fittings on the strut itself.

The struts appear to be mounted at the same point where OYO's friend suggested, and OYO mounted his struts.

If anybody has any further insight on the original gas strut install, I'm all ears. Without any further info on the original install, I will be looking to replace with 60PSI struts.

Just as an aside, there are 4 struts to lift the dormer roof and dormer front into place - these work great. A gentle push on each part of the dormer, and the struts put the part into place. I then pull the dormer roof down to the front window section and latch - exactly the way struts should work. I want to replicate the success with the roof.

Will probably order a replacement lift motor, too - but I think the struts are the key to keeping the motor working. The lift motor on my 2019 is mounted at the bottom and geared at the bottom of the lift. The top has colored plastic seals, and the whole lift plugs into an electrical socket for easier replacement. Being in Colorado, my A-frame does not get exposed to a lot of rain.

2019 Flagstaff T21TBHW A-frame
2008 Hyundai Entourage minivan
camping Colorado and adjacent states one weekend at a time

I hate to be the one to break the news to you...what you are describing is the early signs of the actuator failure. My brand new 2019 A213HW with less than 3 months went through the same symptoms. It got progressively slower and slower until it just locked in the full open position. I had to remove the actuator in order to close the A-frame and get home. The struts were fine. I got a new actuator and everything is back to new. I've posted some pictures of the failed part that shows water dripping out of the seals of the actuator. Others have shown the same. Good luck!

[pgandw]

Originally Posted by Zoinks

I hate to be the one to break the news to you...what you are describing is the early signs of the actuator failure. My brand new 2019 A213HW with less than 3 months went through the same symptoms. It got progressively slower and slower until it just locked in the full open position. I had to remove the actuator in order to close the A-frame and get home. The struts were fine. I got a new actuator and everything is back to new. I've posted some pictures of the failed part that shows water dripping out of the seals of the actuator. Others have shown the same. Good luck!

You missed my point - I have 2 different gas struts for assisting the roof lift. I am trying to determine which one is correct, and which one is not. I would love to know the model number of both your struts to compare.

Whether or not my actuator is going bad is immaterial to the strut issue.

In looking at the history of the roof lift on FR HW A-frames, it's a history of a system that doesn't work well - at least not for long. On the 2019 models, gas struts were added to reduce the load on the actuator. And the actuator now plugs into an electrical port instead of being hard-wired to make replacement easier. I have raised the roof at least 50 times since buying my 2019 T21TBHW (same as A213HW) 15 months ago, which is a lot more than many have reported getting (especially earlier years) before encountering actuator problems.

The history appears to show a root cause of an under-powered actuator for the loads encountered. And that's besides the environmental issues of not being able to seal the actuator from the elements. I'm not sure a more powerful actuator would be the right fix because of the single point application of force on a roof that has minimal structural rigidity for weight reduction. Dual actuators would be a matching nightmare, and less than perfect matching would induce even more twisting forces than the single actuator.

I coming to believe that FR was on the right track with the strut assist to the actuator. And as Craig has pointed out, more powerful struts might just do away with the actuator altogether. The struts on the dormer work wonderfully, and there is no actuator.

I want to correct my strut issues before I mount another actuator, to give it the best chance to survive long term.

Fred W
2019 Flagstaff T21TBHW A-frame
2008 Hyundai Entourage minivan
camping Colorado and adjacent states one weekend at a time

[pgandw]

My 2019 Flagstaff T21TBHW (same as Rockwood A213HW) A-frame came with mismatched 40# struts for help lifting the main roof. I ordered 36" ST360P60-W 60# struts with ball socket replacements from Lift Supports Depot (liftsupportsdepot.com) yesterday. Very nice people to deal with on the phone.

Hope to install them before we leave for Texas on 27 Dec.

Fred W
2019 Flagstaff T21TBHW A-frame
2008 Hyundai Entourage minivan
camping Colorado and adjacent states one weekend at a time

[traveling.geocacher]

pgandw,
I look forward to how they work for you. I'd love to do away with the assist lift. If I don't use the lift, I have two poles we use to push up the roof.
Chris

[pgandw]

Installed the new lift supports yesterday. In the process, discovered a few disturbing things. First, I should note my 2019 Flagstaff T21TBHW (same as A213HW) came standard with 40# gas struts connected on each side to the forward roof section. One of the manufacturer installed struts was 36" max, the other was 34" max. The struts appeared to give some assistance to the electric lift when the camper was new, but no longer seemed to be doing anything.

• The lower mounting brackets - the ones mounted to the body of the camper - were not in the same place on both sides. They were, however, both located exactly 36" from the roof bracket pin with the roof up and latched. The replacement 36" struts fit perfectly, even if they aren't exactly parallel.
• The port (left) side lower mount bracket was simply screwed (5 #8 screws) into the side of the camper with a rubber gasket underneath. To me this was unacceptable if I was going to use 60# struts. The camper wall is a layer of fiberglass-like material glued to lightweight foam with an inner wall of thin plywood with an interior printed vinyl-like thin liner glued to the plywood. I made a 1/4" plywood backing plate and drilled and through-bolted the strut mounting bracket (5 #10 bolts). The dinette seat back normally covers the backing plate and nuts. I did stain/varnish the backing plate, and put acorn nuts over the nyloc nuts. At another time, I will probably shorten down to 1.75" bolts from the 2" bolts I used.
• The starboard side mount also was screwed into the wall from the factory. However, right behind the mounting bracket was the wood mounting strip and the hinge for the toilet area cover. I ended up drilling through both the wood strip and piano hinge, and using 2.5" bolts. The wood strip and the hinge serve as a backing plate.
• I caulked the mounting brackets with a clear (non-silicon) exterior caulk.
• It got dark as I got finished, so I simply used the electric lift to lower the roof and put the A-frame back in the garage. It seemed to work quite smoothly.

I had called Flagstaff to order a new outside shower plastic enclosure because I cracked the original installing the new thumb locks. I also ordered a new electric lift motor assembly - the old lift motor has gotten very anemic and needs push assistance on the rear roof handle to get the roof up. Don't know whether the motor/drive or failing gas struts were/are the cause. Flagstaff gave it to me for free as a good will item - I am about 3 months out of warranty, with no warranty claims. Thank you very much to Flagstaff.

When the new lift motor assembly arrives, will take the camper back out and try lifting with the old motor/new struts, just the new struts alone, and new struts/new motor to see which I like best, and what problems I still have.

Fred W
2019 Flagstaff T21TBHW A-frame
2008 Hyundai Entourage minivan
camping Colorado and adjacent states one weekend at a time

[SGTSTORM]

Is anyone aware of any you tube videos on this installation? I got a replacement actuator for my A212HW. However, they did not send the Zamp plug outlet for me to plug my new unit into. I ordered one on Amazon, and it should be here today. I have looked for videos, but have not found any for this purpose. They are all for solar panels. Do I need to worry about the polarity? The wires in my trailer are brown and white. The wires on the new plug appear to be black and red. The new actuator will just plug right in, but I would feel better attaching the wires under the bed if I knew the polarity was not an issue.

[TrailerTexan]

The polarity needs to be correct for the actuator switch to work in the "extend" or "retract" positions. It will not damage your trailer if you get it backwards but it will stall the actuator; that won't hurt the actuator but might blow a fuse if you leave it stalled for a long time.

I recommend temporarily connecting the actuator wires to the trailer connector and have someone press the switch for "extend" while the roof is down; the actuator will either stall or it will begin to extend. If it stalls then stop pressing the switch and reverse the wires. If it extends then you have the polarity correct; At that point you can wire the zamp connector as you need.

FYI the zamp connector is physically the same pin/socket as the flat 2 or 4 wire trailer connectors that have been used forever and are available at auto parts stores or Walmart. If you can't find the 2 wire then you can always cut a 4 wire connector into two pieces using wire cutters so that you have a new connector with one socket and one exposed pin. That can help just in case you damage it and don't want to wait for an order to arrive.

[SGTSTORM]

Thank you so much! I am trying to do this myself but have very little understanding. The wires in the new socket are black and red. The wires where it needs to connect are brown and white. Is this significant?

[TrailerTexan]

Not really. The power reverses based on direction of the actuator. The brown will be +12V and white will be return (commonly called "ground") for one direction. The brown will be return and the white will be +12V for the other. The actuator will extend with +12V on the red wire with return on black and vice versa.

The switch is what flips the power connections for extend/retract.

[SGTSTORM]

Thanks.

[SGTSTORM]

Originally Posted by SGTSTORM

Thanks.

Thanks again for for help. I did it! Backwards first, but then I fixed it. I would not have done it without your help!

[NormTn]

After 4 lifts in 4 seasons we lift it manually with no problems. working to design a new lifter, The company ignores the issue,

[Zoinks]

Well, the new actuator FR sent me just failed again. Less than a year old. I’m becoming convinced that it’s a water intrusion problem. The newly designed actuator had new gasketed joints and seals. We had a super hot day followed by a down pour. Next time we closed the camper the actuator had failed. I’ve removed it and set it aside and the water is leaking out of the body. A lot of rusted water! We’ll see if it works after the water drains out. Now I’m seeing about warranty and practicing the manual open/close process.

[Magnus]

i recently purchased a Real Lite 1604 SS Palomino truck camper and the right hand side lift has gone out....after a month of use. i suspect moisture has caused this as there is rust dripping out of the unit. I have not even made my first payment and this has occurred. Whats concerning is that not a single location given to me by forest river will do warranty work for them. I have asked for the part and they have indicated that they can't ship me a replacement part because of "liability issues" the warranty manager
Jerald Summey <JSummey@forestriverinc.com> and the relations manager Michael Locke <mlocke@forestriverinc.com> have not been helpful at all. They sent me a list and then said I was on my own. after reporting to them that the entire list refused the work they said I need to find a mobile RV tech. I have yet to find a mobile tech to work on the unit or accept parts. Is anyone else having these type issues with the Forest River warranty team>? Has anyone considered legal action? This issue seems far-reaching and across the board for Forest River products.

[OYO]

Originally Posted by Magnus

i recently purchased a Real Lite 1604 SS Palomino truck camper and the right hand side lift has gone out....after a month of use. i suspect moisture has caused this as there is rust dripping out of the unit. I have not even made my first payment and this has occurred. Whats concerning is that not a single location given to me by forest river will do warranty work for them. I have asked for the part and they have indicated that they can't ship me a replacement part because of "liability issues" the warranty manager
Jerald Summey <JSummey@forestriverinc.com> and the relations manager Michael Locke <mlocke@forestriverinc.com> have not been helpful at all. They sent me a list and then said I was on my own. after reporting to them that the entire list refused the work they said I need to find a mobile RV tech. I have yet to find a mobile tech to work on the unit or accept parts. Is anyone else having these type issues with the Forest River warranty team>? Has anyone considered legal action? This issue seems far-reaching and across the board for Forest River products.

I don't known if there is a truck camper subforum, but if so you might get more input there. This is an A-Frame subforum.

I did get a replacement actuator under warranty directly from Forest River, but I think my dealer ordered it. That was four years ago and it lasted about a year.

Good luck.