A non-propane heating alternative?

[DouglasReid]

Originally Posted by marinerjoe

I didn’t intend on stirring up a sh!t storm with my original post. I do appreciate the responses regarding alternatives and preferences. And to set the record straight, I wasn’t advertising because I have no financial relationship with the manufacturer.

For our application in a small camper and being (so far) temperate weather campers, this just might suit our needs. SWMBO doesn’t want more loose stuff that requires storing, and with two young beagles (and two other dogs that don’t usually come along), free standing units and extra cords around isn’t a good choice.

Regarding wall mounting on flimsy or exterior walls, my plan is to mount it in place of the non-opening door at the bottom of the entertainment “stack” that provides access to the outside grill hose. That structure seems to be more substantial than elsewhere, and if necessary I can beef it up a bit with pine strips on the back side. If pine isn’t the best wood choice, I’m sure I’ll get plenty of other material recommendations.

I bought the plug in version, and if it performs as well as I hope, I’ll likely cut off the cord and hard wire it to the backside of one of the outlets in the vicinity.

This forum is a GREAT resource for ideas and discussion. In the short time I’ve been here, I’ve learned a LOT to help me make my camper owner experience better.

Don't let all those who are nit pickers get you down. Some people just like to act like jerks and feel empowered when they can remain faceless.

I don't think hard wiring to the back of an outlet is a good idea though. You will never be able to turn it off unless you kill the breaker to that circuit and then you won't have access to them.

[marinerjoe]

Thanks Doug. I’m not new to forums and have a thick skin (and head).

On the hard wiring, they do sell a hard-wired version. And I’m presuming the thermostat when turned all the way down shuts it off. But I’ll confirm everything before I do anything.

After this week, it’s time to shift attention away from the camper and focus on the boat. I’ve got an Axiom Pro to install and test and other items are in the wings. Woo hoo!

[TheWolfPaq82]

Originally Posted by jtesta1

U238 in a coffee can.

Heat and a Night Light.....nice combination.

[Jmw1]

I have had a Envi wall heater in 3 campers. I installed it in the bedroom. We close the bedroom door and turn off the gas furnace, which is really loud when it runs. The Envi has no fan so it is silent. It keeps the bedroom nice and toasty. Even at 30 degrees it works great.

[rockfordroo]

Originally Posted by DouglasReid

picky, picky, picky!

Everyone knew what he meant

You would be surprised! Some people don't know 120VAC from 12VDC.

Many people don't know watts from amps from volts.

Do you want me to call a converter an inverter? I wouldn't think so.

[kayo]

one watt = 3.14 btuh (btu per hour) With an electric heater, you get 3.14 btuh out id the heater - any heater - no more no less regardless of the make and model! Right now I am paying about $ .11 per kw (1000 watts) or 3415 bths

RV furnaces are notoriously inefficient. All you have to do is go outside when your furnace is running and feel the tremendous amount of heat lost in the furnace exhaust. So a btu generated by propane will only put 60-70 % of the heat of an electric generated btu.

A gallon of propane has 90,513 btu's. When burned, using the above efficiencies, you will only get 54,308 - 60,000 btu's oh heat in your rig

Right now I am paying about $0.11 per 1 kw or $1.93 for the same output of a gallon of propane that sells here in Los Alamos for $3.14/gal.

In most parks, for short term use, electric is included in your camping fees

This is just high school physics

[DouglasReid]

Originally Posted by kayo

one watt = 3.14 btuh (btu per hour) With an electric heater, you get 3.14 btuh out id the heater - any heater - no more no less regardless of the make and model! Right now I am paying about $ .11 per kw (1000 watts) or 3415 bths

RV furnaces are notoriously inefficient. All you have to do is go outside when your furnace is running and feel the tremendous amount of heat lost in the furnace exhaust. So a btu generated by propane will only put 60-70 % of the heat of an electric generated btu.

A gallon of propane has 90,513 btu's. When burned, using the above efficiencies, you will only get 54,308 - 60,000 btu's oh heat in your rig

Right now I am paying about $0.11 per 1 kw or $1.93 for the same output of a gallon of propane that sells here in Los Alamos for $3.14/gal.

In most parks, for short term use, electric is included in your camping fees

This is just high school physics

We use electric heaters too, mostly at night and low power, to keep the chill off.

The propane heats up the camper much faster and has the advantage of running on a thermostat. This way we do not have to keep turning the electric heater on and off. It is a simple convenience thing.

[grumpyoldman]

Originally Posted by ACJC

I'll stick with my heat pump/A/C and when it's below 35 fire up the furnace

X2

[Carl Patterson]

Will have to check it out

[SternHappens]

I appreciate using the campground electricity to heat the passenger compartment with a couple of small space heaters and save the propane, but what is the work around or mod to compensate for the insulated bay with water tank and pump underneath that has a vent from the built in propane furnace? Is there a way to tap into that vent and pump in some warm air from the passenger compartment. I have the water tank heater, but will that will the water lines in that bay or just the tank? Other than letting a sink drip, how do you keep lines from freezing using electric heat?

[Oaklevel]

We have always had to camp on a tight budget so what ever a discount store has as in an electric heater that looks like what we need is what we have used.

Currently we have a ceramic cube and a small tower. The tower on its own thermostat has heated an unheated TH toy room down to 32 degrees nicely. (We rarely camp under freezing).

[BamaBob]

Originally Posted by SternHappens

I appreciate using the campground electricity to heat the passenger compartment with a couple of small space heaters and save the propane, but what is the work around or mod to compensate for the insulated bay with water tank and pump underneath that has a vent from the built in propane furnace? Is there a way to tap into that vent and pump in some warm air from the passenger compartment. I have the water tank heater, but will that will the water lines in that bay or just the tank? Other than letting a sink drip, how do you keep lines from freezing using electric heat?

It depends - how cold is "cold" Also, doesn't the Georgetown have tank heaters? Go ahead and turn them on (and leave them on) - they will only operate below 40°

If you are keeping your main cabin comfortable - say low 70's - the pipes should be OK. Still, if you get paranoid (like we did in 11° weather) we just let the kitchen sink dribble.

[PamJohnZephyr]

On a trip out west a few weeks ago, we ran into a CG that said, "NO ELECTRIC HEATERS!" on signs throughout the park. So far that's the only place I've seen that banned them. This was in Welcome, MN of all places!

[Rokslinger]

Originally Posted by SternHappens

I appreciate using the campground electricity to heat the passenger compartment with a couple of small space heaters and save the propane, but what is the work around or mod to compensate for the insulated bay with water tank and pump underneath that has a vent from the built in propane furnace? Is there a way to tap into that vent and pump in some warm air from the passenger compartment. I have the water tank heater, but will that will the water lines in that bay or just the tank? Other than letting a sink drip, how do you keep lines from freezing using electric heat?

In my Forester, you can access the water, pump, filter, plumbig from an outside compartment, in which I run a small space heater when it freezes, about 250 watts, I think. (My Heat). Works perfect.

[rockfordroo]

Some folks just put a 100W light bulb in there.

[A32Deuce]

Originally Posted by CedarCreekWoody

Although a bit bulky the electric heaters that look like a radiator can develop a safe heat. They are oil filled.

X2!

[A32Deuce]

Originally Posted by PamJohnZephyr

On a trip out west a few weeks ago, we ran into a CG that said, "NO ELECTRIC HEATERS!" on signs throughout the park. So far that's the only place I've seen that banned them. This was in Welcome, MN of all places!

There are several Camp Grounds that have that. Usually found on their rules sheet.

[marinerjoe]

On the "no electric heaters," do they do surprise inspections?

[Islander]

Originally Posted by Evereddie

I have to say it again. Electric heaters are electric heaters. Watts equals how much heat you get. How pretty the thing is equals how much money you wasted.
Nuff said.

Not quit.... it's all in the design !

For 25 years we have been using eruo style electric wall heaters in our 3300 sq ft home.
Their design is based on the 'convection effect' causing the heated air to travel within a cavity drawing more air in from the bottom to be heated.
To feel the air being expelled you would think it was fan forced but it is not.

Also ours has the electronic controls that are designed to pulse off and on as compared to be on continually... thus saving power.

So it's not just about watts.... it has a lot to do with design.

I really don't think a 1500 watt hair dryer would heat a 325 sq ft trailer very well.

Islander

[A32Deuce]

Originally Posted by marinerjoe

On the "no electric heaters," do they do surprise inspections?

Don't know and don't intend to find out! Have seen the wording in a lot of other parts of the country. Guess that's why some are going to metered sites and you pay by what overage you use.