Brake Controller Setup and Brake Locking

[AndyA]

Originally Posted by Qwkynuf

You have to understand that this isn't rocket surgery. There isn't one single, precise, razor's edge, *correct* value or setup. Get it good, and then don't sacrifice that good on the altar of perfect.

Normally I would agree however:

• People have reported that their brakes give a very different performance to mine
• People have reported grease soaked brake assemblies from the factory
• I don't know what 'good' is for my TV and my trailer
• Two FR dealers gave me opposite advice which means I don't trust either of them
• The advice from FR is different to both of their dealers
• The manual for the brake controller doesn't give if/ands/buts, it gives a clear procedure that I can't even follow. But nobody knows why. I would hope that Tekonsha understands trailer brakes

Andy

[rsdata]

How do you know the trailer brakes are working properly? Can you feel them? Have you measured the current draw?

You really do have a minimum trailer that your tow vehicle could handle stopping without any trailer brakes.

I would set the controller 1/2 way and drive and brake normally for a thousand miles or so. Then do the parking lot thing, pulling and stopping with trailer brakes only playing with the controller. You should be able to feel the trailer pull you to a gradual stop when they are set correctly. If that never happens then remove a wheel, pull the brake drum and look for grease on the brakes ( probably not there) or if the brakes are even adjusted properly. Have a knowledgeable friend or a tire shop work with you if you don't feel that you know enough to figure this out. However, the dealership is probably the LAST place to get competent trailer help with brakes...

[Qwkynuf]

Originally Posted by AndyA

Normally I would agree however:

• People have reported that their brakes give a very different performance to mine
• People have reported grease soaked brake assemblies from the factory
• I don't know what 'good' is for my TV and my trailer
• Two FR dealers gave me opposite advice which means I don't trust either of them
• The advice from FR is different to both of their dealers
• The manual for the brake controller doesn't give if/ands/buts, it gives a clear procedure that I can't even follow. But nobody knows why. I would hope that Tekonsha understands trailer brakes

Andy

oookkkkaaaayyyy.....

But you are here on a forum, asking a question that literally no one here can answer for you. So you get a bunch of good-faith guesses that aren't what you want to hear.

Please accept my apology for trying to help.

[MR.M]

Originally Posted by AndyA

Normally I would agree however:

• People have reported that their brakes give a very different performance to mine
• People have reported grease soaked brake assemblies from the factory
• I don't know what 'good' is for my TV and my trailer
• Two FR dealers gave me opposite advice which means I don't trust either of them
• The advice from FR is different to both of their dealers
• The manual for the brake controller doesn't give if/ands/buts, it gives a clear procedure that I can't even follow. But nobody knows why. I would hope that Tekonsha understands trailer brakes

Andy

Sounds like the Trailer brakes need adjusting . using to much power to get minimal breaking . then you need to get the feel for the TT brakes alone and in conjunction with your TV then set brake controller accordingly . don't expect lock up if the brakes are not adjusted correctly and even then unless on gravel .

[rsdata]

even then unless on gravel

ah yes... key work will only lock up on gravel... they will not skid on pavement... correct

[babock]

Originally Posted by AndyA

OK, so, I was never told I needed to do that. I wasn't given a manual for the brakes. However, at the selling dealer I tried to set up the brake controller so in the end I did end up doing it in their car park anyway.

Andy

You did 25 stops from 25MPH to 30MPH in their car park?

Pretty much all brakes, depending on the friction material, require this including the disc brakes on my bicycle.

[AndyA]

Originally Posted by babock

You did 25 stops from 25MPH to 30MPH in their car park?

Pretty much all brakes, depending on the friction material, require this including the disc brakes on my bicycle.

Yes. 25 MPH is the speed that the brake controller requires for setup. I was going around in circles. Car park was large and empty.

Andy

[AndyA]

Originally Posted by Qwkynuf

oookkkkaaaayyyy.....

But you are here on a forum, asking a question that literally no one here can answer for you. So you get a bunch of good-faith guesses that aren't what you want to hear.

Please accept my apology for trying to help.

I do appreciate your response and everyone's response. I am sorry if my post came across as defensive in any way. It was not intended to be.

Nobody else here can drive my vehicle and feel it and I understand that.

Andy

[AndyA]

Originally Posted by rsdata

I would set the controller 1/2 way and drive and brake normally for a thousand miles or so. Then do the parking lot thing, pulling and stopping with trailer brakes only playing with the controller. You should be able to feel the trailer pull you to a gradual stop when they are set correctly.

This exactly describes what I have done and what is now happening so it is reassuring to hear someone else describe the same thing.

However, the dealership is probably the LAST place to get competent trailer help with brakes

Yes, I am starting to get that impression!

Thanks, Andy

[CincyGus]

You have a very solid performing brake controller. I used them multiple times on different trailers. What rsdata describes and you say you are currently experiencing sounds right to me.

One question I have not seen asked is "Is your controller mounted level?"

And you are aware it is a proportional braking system so just applying the trailer brake is going to give a very low braking effect. You will not receive a maximum braking effect unless you are braking at a maximum in your truck.

A clip from the etrailer website on your specific controller:

Proportional Braking

With a proportional brake controller, you can get heavy-duty emergency braking, general braking or slow-to-an-idle braking for your trailer automatically. The intensity with which your trailer brakes are activated and the rate at which they are applied are dependent on the deceleration of your tow vehicle. This means that, unlike time-delay controllers - which send the same amount of preset power to your trailer brakes every time - proportional controllers are able to adapt to every braking situation differently. So, if you slam on the brakes in your truck, your trailer brakes will activate with that same extreme intensity. And if you merely slow down as you approach a red light, your trailer will gradually brake in the same manner. Just set the initial power level, select a boost setting, and you're good to go.


As long as the P3 controller sits level on a horizontal plane and is pointed in the direction of travel, it will sense - via an internal inertia sensor - how your tow vehicle brakes. This inertia-based sensor responds to the deceleration of your tow vehicle as you brake by signaling the controller to send out enough power to your trailer brakes so that they are activated with an intensity that matches. The result is uniform braking across your towing setup. No push-pull action - just smooth, proportional braking every time.

If you didn't see this, I hope this sets your mind at ease as it sounds like your getting the expected results. If you feel your not, maybe try a 35mph test and really slam on the truck brakes and see if the trailer brakes respond in kind as the above info indicates they should.

Here is the website where I got the above information:

https://www.etrailer.com/Trailer-Bra...EaAohuEALw_wcB

[Cost4133]

Originally Posted by CincyGus

If you didn't see this, I hope this sets your mind at ease as it sounds like your getting the expected results. If you feel your not, maybe try a 35mph test and really slam on the truck brakes and see if the trailer brakes respond in kind as the above info indicates they should.

Here is the website where I got the above information:

https://www.etrailer.com/Trailer-Bra...EaAohuEALw_wcB

I am going to respectfully disagree, when manually activated at 12V, those brakes should be grabbing hard. Using the manual slide takes the proportional mechanism out of the equation.

Your brakes are either misadjusted like many have had a problem with, or they are grease saturated which many have also had a problem with.

[Mike134]

Originally Posted by Cost4133

I am going to respectfully disagree, when manually activated at 12V, those brakes should be grabbing hard. Using the manual slide takes the proportional mechanism out of the equation.

Your brakes are either misadjusted like many have had a problem with, or they are grease saturated which many have also had a problem with.

\


X2!!

[MR.M]

the last thing you want is the wheels to lock-up if the emergency pin is pulled . it should activate the brakes solidly to stop the trailer . If you come un-hooked and they lock-up it can be a real mess with what you have left over . proper adjustment is needed and do not come from factory adjusted only assembled

[AndyA]

Update - based on the replies on here I called LCI and spoke to a technician who has worked with axles for years. He confirmed:

- my brakes are not working properly
- the burnishing procedure needs higher speeds than 25-30 MPH
- the selling dealer was incorrect in setting the brake controller gain so that the tow vehicle just stops creeping forwards in drive

I now have detailed instructions on how to re-do the burnishing to get the brakes up to 400F to burn off the assembly grease and I will try that, hopefully this weekend, and will report back.

Andy

[MR.M]

Originally Posted by AndyA

Update - based on the replies on here I called LCI and spoke to a technician who has worked with axles for years. He confirmed:

- my brakes are not working properly
- the burnishing procedure needs higher speeds than 25-30 MPH
- the selling dealer was incorrect in setting the brake controller gain so that the tow vehicle just stops creeping forwards in drive

I now have detailed instructions on how to re-do the burnishing to get the brakes up to 400F to burn off the assembly grease and I will try that, hopefully this weekend, and will report back.

Andy

Assembly grease on the brakes ? that's a new one

[babock]

Yes, on the pivot points where the shoes rest on the backing plate. Also to the adjuster.

Burning it off is just plain wrong though.

Originally Posted by MR.M

Assembly grease on the brakes ? that's a new one

[MR.M]

Originally Posted by babock

Yes, on the pivot points where the shoes rest on the backing plate. Also to the adjuster.
OP states this
Burning it off is just plain wrong though.

I now have detailed instructions on how to re-do the burnishing to get the brakes up to 400F to burn off the assembly grease and I will try that, hopefully this weekend, and will report back.




. grease on the pivot point and adjuster will not burn off . so he must be talking about the pads ? as grease on the pivot points and adjuster would not effect operation to the point of no brakes .

[babock]

Exactly and I said that.

There is no assembly grease that is going to burn off.
.

Originally Posted by MR.M

I now have detailed instructions on how to re-do the burnishing to get the brakes up to 400F to burn off the assembly grease and I will try that, hopefully this weekend, and will report back.




. grease on the pivot point and adjuster will not burn off . so he must be talking about the pads ? as grease on the pivot points and adjuster would not effect operation to the point of no brakes .

[MR.M]

Originally Posted by babock

Exactly and I said that.

There is no assembly grease that is going to burn off.
.

Ok I just don't know why you directed it to me and not the op !

[Reverse_snowbird]

Originally Posted by AndyA

However all I could feel was a very slight slowing of the vehicle. I flicked the lever on and off a few times and each time it was just a slight retardation of the vehicle motion. No "grabbing", no skidding, no whiplash, nothing.

I can't believe that a slight retardation is correct performance for the brakes.

Andy

I guess I don't understand. Why would you want 'grabbing, skidding and whiplash'?
When operating properly, the brakes on the trailer and tow vehicle should operate as one vehicle. If you feel the trailer stopping your truck, that's not right. If the truck feels like it's being 'pushed' by the trailer when you go to stop, that's not right either. (Mountains the exception to being pushed by the trailer )

We had our emergency trailer brake cable come out as we turned a corner at a very slow speed. The brakes did indeed lock up and the trailer and truck came to a very abrupt stop. The thought of those trailer brakes locking up driving down the highway with the truck attached would terrify me. They are only supposed to lock up if the trailer becomes disconnected from the truck.

I'm wondering what made you question the brake setup in the first place if you've driven 2000 miles with no problem.