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Old 03-20-2017, 11:30 AM   #21
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It will handle either one! Youroo!!


Good to know, thank you!
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Old 03-20-2017, 10:43 PM   #22
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Well I'm coming to you guys again, cause you guys NEVER let me down. I found a Yamaha EF 3000iS for a sale. I can scoop her up for about $1150 (used). Unfortunately the seller doesn't know if it'll run the 15k A/C. Is it safe to assume that it will, since the Champion 3000 will run the larger units? Sorry for all my ignorance. We have a Kipor 3000 generator but it won't run the A/C so I'm skeptical and I'd have to drive about two hours to buy the Yamaha. From what I've researched the Yamaha peaks at 3000 + 500 boost watts. Our current Kipor generator tops out at 2.6 kVA (can't find the conversion to watts) and the 15k unit requires 3300-3500 (per the internet, not my specific unit). Again, any advice would be appreciated!
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Old 03-20-2017, 10:52 PM   #23
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2.6 KVA is about 2.1 KW
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Old 03-20-2017, 10:55 PM   #24
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2.6 KVA is about 2.1 KW


Which is what? How many watts?
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Old 03-20-2017, 11:04 PM   #25
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Which is what? How many watts?
2100 watts. That generator is a "3000" because it's 2.6 KVA rounded up...probably considering surge. Volts times amps equals watts, however, when something is rate in VA, or KVA, it's rated for "apparent power", not it's real or true power output. It's cheating because it's KVA (VA) rating will always be higher than it's actual wattage output.

The reason is, there are three different types of power...without trying to confuse too much. Apparent power, true power, and reactive power. On the "power triangle", apparent power (KVA, or VA) is the hypotenuse, and real power, the power you actually get at the load, is the adjacent to the hypotenuse. In other words, the real power is less than apparent power, so the manufacturer rates it in apparent power to make you believe you are getting more generator than you really are.

Edit: On a side note, the KVA ratings do give you a better idea of how large a load it will start.
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Old 03-20-2017, 11:10 PM   #26
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2100 watts. That generator is a "3000" because it's 2.6 KVA rounded up...probably considering surge. Volts times amps equals watts, however, when something is rate in VA, or KVA, it's rated for "apparent power", not it's real or true power output. It's cheating because it's KVA (VA) rating will always be higher than it's actual wattage output.



The reason is, there are three different types of power...without trying to confuse too much. Apparent power, true power, and reactive power. On the "power triangle", apparent power (KVA, or VA) is the hypotenuse, and real power, the power you actually get at the load, is the adjacent to the hypotenuse. In other words, the real power is less than apparent power, so the manufacturer rates it in apparent power to make you believe you are getting more generator than you really are.


So I was bamboozled! Well it worked great for the 7-8 years that we had it. Now it's too small and I already have a few potential buyers so it's all good.

You obviously know what you're talking about, so what's ur thoughts on the Yamaha EF3000iS? Is it big enough for what I need?
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Old 03-20-2017, 11:22 PM   #27
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So I was bamboozled! Well it worked great for the 7-8 years that we had it. Now it's too small and I already have a few potential buyers so it's all good.

You obviously know what you're talking about, so what's ur thoughts on the Yamaha EF3000iS? Is it big enough for what I need?
I wouldn't go so far as saying that. Generator ratings are kind of nebulous, at least for the cheap ones. I looked at the manufacturer website. It said it was rated at 2800W. I'm not sure where you got the 2.6KVA number as at 2800W, the KVA number would be higher.

On one hand, we are familiar with seeing ratings in watts. That's what we are used to, but KVA ratings, if you look at them for what they are, tell you more of how well the generator can supply its power, rather than the actual power it puts out.
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Old 03-22-2017, 11:29 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by rat4spd View Post
2100 watts. That generator is a "3000" because it's 2.6 KVA rounded up...probably considering surge. Volts times amps equals watts, however, when something is rate in VA, or KVA, it's rated for "apparent power", not it's real or true power output. It's cheating because it's KVA (VA) rating will always be higher than it's actual wattage output.

The reason is, there are three different types of power...without trying to confuse too much. Apparent power, true power, and reactive power. On the "power triangle", apparent power (KVA, or VA) is the hypotenuse, and real power, the power you actually get at the load, is the adjacent to the hypotenuse. In other words, the real power is less than apparent power, so the manufacturer rates it in apparent power to make you believe you are getting more generator than you really are.

Edit: On a side note, the KVA ratings do give you a better idea of how large a load it will start.
Here's something for you visual people.....wish I would have had this in school.
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Old 03-22-2017, 03:24 PM   #29
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Here's something for you visual people.....wish I would have had this in school.
Finally a graphic I can understand!
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Old 03-22-2017, 03:44 PM   #30
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Well I'm coming to you guys again, cause you guys NEVER let me down. I found a Yamaha EF 3000iS for a sale. I can scoop her up for about $1150 (used). Unfortunately the seller doesn't know if it'll run the 15k A/C. Is it safe to assume that it will, since the Champion 3000 will run the larger units? Sorry for all my ignorance. We have a Kipor 3000 generator but it won't run the A/C so I'm skeptical and I'd have to drive about two hours to buy the Yamaha. From what I've researched the Yamaha peaks at 3000 + 500 boost watts. Our current Kipor generator tops out at 2.6 kVA (can't find the conversion to watts) and the 15k unit requires 3300-3500 (per the internet, not my specific unit). Again, any advice would be appreciated!
OR... you could buy this brand new one with a warranty for $977.77 delivered to your door. Available many places online including Bottom Line Trading.
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Old 03-22-2017, 04:19 PM   #31
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Finally a graphic I can understand!
LOL.....Me too !
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Old 03-22-2017, 04:30 PM   #32
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I would say the champions are a pretty good value and there are several flavors available- 2000, 2800, 3100, 3400, 3500 and some with remote start. Loudness is a little bit more than the hondas but nothing to start a lynch mob at a campground. Unless it is an open frame!
Coming from you, that is the SUPREME compliment. I think my 2000 watt Champ is as quiet as the Honda equivalent.
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Old 03-22-2017, 04:36 PM   #33
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OR... you could buy this brand new one with a warranty for $977.77 delivered to your door. Available many places online including Bottom Line Trading.
Too heavy for this old fart and the stock wheels are too small to wheel it around except on concrete. Gimme a pair of 2000 Champs and a parallel kit. I can heft the 2000 champs easily and paralleled they give plenty of ooomph, plus, if you don't need both, you can run just one on the cheap gas wise.

Finally, the pair are cheaper than the Honda.
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Old 03-22-2017, 04:42 PM   #34
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FYI, Generators Direct is cheaper......
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Old 03-22-2017, 05:09 PM   #35
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The 3100 watt Champion inverter generator is $699 at local Costco or online. Bought one a year ago and runs the 15k a/c on my 2014 Flagstaff with no problem. Never tried to load it up with hair dryers etc.. to see what it would handle. It is pretty quiet and from my research before buying the consensus is it is just slightly louder than the Honda as others have said here. The 3100 weighs 76 lbs so I can load it up in truck myself.
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Old 03-22-2017, 07:49 PM   #36
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OR... you could buy this brand new one with a warranty for $977.77 delivered to your door. Available many places online including Bottom Line Trading.



Yes, I'm seriously eyeing this specific unit as well. My only concern is the noise level. If I recall correctly, this measures at 58 decibels at 25'. Isn't that loud enough to piss off my neighbors? Is it quieter on propane or electric?
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Old 03-22-2017, 08:44 PM   #37
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Just to add my favorite comment to these threads...

The reason you usually need more than a single 2k generator to run either a 13.5 or 15K AC is due to the amount of energy needed to start the AC unit. Once started, either will run on the 2K gennies. If your only need for a generator is to run the AC and are willing to turn off the AC to run the microwave or hairdryer, take a look at putting an EasyStart by MicroAire on your AC unit. Note that this is NOT a hard-start capacitor, and costs around $350. Still less than most of the generator solutions.

There is a thread on the Airstream forum talking about these. Several folks there are claiming that you can reliably run a 15K AC on a 2K generator if the AC unit has one of these installed.

What is a bit depressing to me, MicroAire offered a discount to the Airstream people and not us lesser RVers!
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Old 03-22-2017, 08:51 PM   #38
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I ran my 15k on a yammy 2400.
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Old 03-22-2017, 09:06 PM   #39
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Here's something for you visual people.....wish I would have had this in school.
i've never seen the power triangle displayed like that. It sure makes even the bad stuff seem good. I like it.
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Old 03-22-2017, 09:08 PM   #40
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Just to add my favorite comment to these threads...

The reason you usually need more than a single 2k generator to run either a 13.5 or 15K AC is due to the amount of energy needed to start the AC unit. Once started, either will run on the 2K gennies. If your only need for a generator is to run the AC and are willing to turn off the AC to run the microwave or hairdryer, take a look at putting an EasyStart by MicroAire on your AC unit. Note that this is NOT a hard-start capacitor, and costs around $350. Still less than most of the generator solutions.

There is a thread on the Airstream forum talking about these. Several folks there are claiming that you can reliably run a 15K AC on a 2K generator if the AC unit has one of these installed.

What is a bit depressing to me, MicroAire offered a discount to the Airstream people and not us lesser RVers!


Why have I never heard of this?! I'm on google now and I'll be calling my RV tech tomorrow! THANK YOU!
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