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Old 02-01-2023, 05:25 PM   #1
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Europa Quality Control

So the day finally came and our Europa arrived, we had hired a transport service to get it from the Dealer to us and they did a great job. However when the Europa arrived there's numerous things I'm really not happy about. A lot of them have to do with the dealer who I won't name until they have a chance to make it right, but there are a couple of things that concern me from Dynamax itself.

The couch is not attached, it had slid while the rig was in motion and we had to push it back into place I can easily move it a few inches at least, haven't tried for more, Is this expected? Given that there are seat belts there, I'd expect it to be pretty rigidly mounted.

The bedroom slide out has a pretty big gap on it I can see daylight and feel a breeze, this is on the lower left side corner when you're facing the headboard:

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Next under the bed, where the matress flips over there's a wire that comes out from the compartment where the water tank is, the cover over it wasn't secured at all, and the wire looks like it's going to be pinched by the cover:

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There's this random wire hanging down from behind the hitch, anyone know what the hell it is?

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Old 02-01-2023, 10:08 PM   #2
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Sorry to hear about your issues but congratulations on getting the Europa. We have the under bed wire too, and thought the same, but it hasn't been an issue. The other issues we didn't/don't have so no help there.
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Old 02-01-2023, 11:23 PM   #3
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The wires out back look like temp wiring set-up for a flat tow maybe. Is it possible delivery person flat towed a vehicle and drove home?
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Old 02-02-2023, 12:03 AM   #4
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The wires out back look like temp wiring set-up for a flat tow maybe. Is it possible delivery person flat towed a vehicle and drove home?
Nope they didnít tow anything
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Old 02-02-2023, 07:11 AM   #5
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Did you do a PDI (Pre delivery inspection) at the dealer before they brought it to you? That is the only way to catch things before the dealer hands it over. Sorry for the issues you are seeing, but it seems those should be corrected fairly easy. Enjoy the new unit.
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Old 02-02-2023, 08:02 AM   #6
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Did the dealer do a PDI ? When we picked up our new Coach in September, McVee RV in Perry, IA did a pretty good Workmanship run through before doing our PDI.

If not, they should have.

When you spend your hard earn money, and it's not exactly a trailer price point, you would anticipate that you are getting something more for your money. Even if it is reduced aggravation.

It's fine that a Dealer would repair Workmanship issues that the Factory did not catch. But by then, the impression on the buyer has already been made. Especially if the Dealer is hours away. And I understand that in this day the work force issues are sizeable. But perhaps that means that that needs to be factored into things like build time.

We were fortunate that McVee told us about any outstanding issues and that they had already been relayed to Dynamax. Most of those issues had to do with the FireFly system. It was the last of the Force/DX3/XL that required revisions due to not being "All Electric".

Only problem on the 1st day that we encountered was at a KOA where we stayed that 1st night. The bedroom slide would not actuate. Fortunately, we were only about 28 miles away from the Dealership. And we were in and out at McVee the next day.

Other issues since. But not on initial drive home.

It's also unfair to put the bulk of the burden on the Dealer. After all the Dealer didn't build the unit. Unless the Dealer provides a week of drive along support, they have no way of knowing what was missed in fabrication. Even if the manufacturer documents their current manufacturing issues, to dealers. Some issues take time to manifest themselves.
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Old 02-02-2023, 09:17 AM   #7
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I would agree that it should not have left the factory with some of these issues. However, I do put the blame on the dealer for not doing a proper PDI before delivery to the OP. At least thatís what it appears to me. None of the stated issues seem like ďhiddenĒ issues that occurred after some usage. They also seem relatively easy to fix. Shame on the dealer for allowing the coach to leave their facility in this condition.
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Old 02-02-2023, 09:26 AM   #8
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unfortunately the dealer is several thousand miles from us, as I said I'm awaiting a response from them before I out them on this, and giving them the chance to make it right, but I'm not sure how they'll do that, which won't involve my wife or I spending a bunch of time dealing with this.

My wife flew down to see the rig before we purchased it, then we did a 2 hour walkthrough with a tech via a facetime call. The dealer said they performed a thorough multi-point inspection before delivery of the rigs, and that they would clean and detail it.

Several things we identified in both my wife's visit and the walkthrough were not corrected, and I'm guessing the mutli-point inspection did not happen (there's a blank inspection form in the delivery paperwork). At this point I'm very concerned what else we'll find when we put water in the rig and try and use it, which we will shortly here in our driveway just so there aren't any surprises.

I agree that the dealer should've caught most of them, but IMHO Dynamax should've caught an unsecured couch, that's ridiculous, and I'm not even sure what to do about the air gap on the slideout, It's unclear to me if that's a case of the slideout isn't going all the way out or what? Very disappointing in a rig of this cost, my previous rig was less than half the cost gasser from newmar and had only one single small cosmetic defect on delivery.
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Old 02-02-2023, 10:12 AM   #9
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I agree that the dealer should've caught most of them, but IMHO Dynamax should've caught an unsecured couch, that's ridiculous, and I'm not even sure what to do about the air gap on the slideout, It's unclear to me if that's a case of the slideout isn't going all the way out or what? Very disappointing in a rig of this cost, my previous rig was less than half the cost gasser from newmar and had only one single small cosmetic defect on delivery.

I agree that when one pays more for a unit, there might be an expectation of higher quality. However, during my RV shopping experience a few years ago, including factory tours, I did not observe Dynamax quality (in the ISATA 3 and 4 lines) to be notably better than some other lower cost FR brands, and sometimes Dynamax lacked some expected features (in the ISATA 3 and 4 lines).


It's sad that your delivery experience did not go well. I'd put blame on both the manufacturer and the dealer in this case. I hope they both chip in to make this right.
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Old 02-02-2023, 11:01 AM   #10
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I feel your pain.

There is a lot of excitement, expectations, and emotions on delivery day, especially when the dealership is far from home. Granted, ours was only several hundred miles away - but we drove there weeks ahead and spent a few hours looking at it. It was brand new but dirty, messy and dead chassis batteries - so no test drive.

Wired money, set a date for PDI and delivery a full two weeks in advance as we wanted to be sure they took their time in getting it right since back and forth was less of an option for us. Arrived to actually watch them slide the refrigerator out the dining window and swap with another unit behind it. Roh-oh, that cant be good. Somehow the fridge went out since we first saw it. Strange, but rather that done here than finding out on the way home. Rig was washed and detailed, about an hour walk through. We planned on staying the night on their "lot". As they finished up the fridge install, they had us sign all of the paperwork, went out to dinner and then they moved the Dynaquest to the overnight lot. Keep in mind the order that all of this just took place.

We set up to spend the night, we ran the washer, ran the dryer, boiled water on the induction top, tested every outlet, every television, every faucet, every drain, every A/C unit, etc. We tried to do everything possible while on their lot. Test drove it finally in the morning and damn, a problem. So, the reality is it was OURS, we signed for it, we paid for it. The dealer said they could take it into Freightliner during the week, but not sure when it would be done. Our alternative was to take it to Freightliner ourselves - it is chassis warranty anyways and one was nearby our home.

Well, its been sitting at Freightliner longer than its been in our driveway. It happens. Frustrating, yes. Somewhere along the route to us driving it, this was likely known but nobody spoke up. Thinking back, we were so excited about finally getting our dream RV, drove a lot to get there, and really didn't want to repeat the process the following week or so. Its been a headache, yup. In the few days in our possession we've uncovered several other small issues, not worth driving hundreds of miles to the dealership so working through those. Should we have caught it earlier? Yup. Should the dealership have caught it? Absolutely. Should Dynamax have caught these? Possibly. But deflated our enthusiasm nonetheless. Costing more than our home, yet the celebratory champagne has been put on hold until all of the shortcomings have been corrected.

It will pass and we will make incredible memories which will overcome this brief moment in time.......
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Old 02-02-2023, 11:46 AM   #11
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As TX_Dynaquest said, it will pass and you will make great memories. Plus, from my experience, no matter how difficult the situation, Dynamax will always make it right, one way or another.
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Old 02-02-2023, 12:27 PM   #12
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1. 100% the sofa should be secured. No excuse at all for that...was something adjusted, was it a shortage that was caught up and placed in the coach but not by the normal installer? Don't know, I will note it for sure, should have been caught

2. Slide Seal. The slide rooms are adjustable. If it was sealing and someone made an adjustment to the rollers, it could have lifted the room ever so slightly. Also...based on that picture, that is the slide "PAN". It is a place for water to run off and into if it gets past the seal. It is designed to have a gutter in there. Depending on how the seal actually "lays" against the gutter it may or may not completely seal. It might even seal the next time you operate it. If it is short, it is as simple as adding a small 1/2" rubber piece to the bottom...we use superglue or self adhesive slide seal. This is not something I would say "there is no excuse to miss this". Just like slide room seals...sometimes they stay flipped in, sometimes they flip out. Its a rubber flap and they don't always do what we ask.

3. Wire under the bed. The bed slide, as I recall sits on rollers. So having that wire there may not be an issue. I have asked that question, as I don't know what it is for and it could be secured better. I would also not say "no excuse for this"

4. Wire under the back. Also don't know what that is, but I have asked. That is also not one I would say "no excuse for this". It could have been up behind resting on the rear cap and no one noticed it...not until driving did it fall down. The only person to blame there is the installed for not properly securing it....but things do move, even if it was, with wind, rain, driving.

Of the 4 items, I would say no excuse for the sofa. The other items may be complete non-issues. We'll see soon.

PS. Just because the driver brining it to your home did not tow a vehicle, does not mean the driver taking it to the dealer did not tow a vehicle.
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Old 02-02-2023, 12:58 PM   #13
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I agree that when one pays more for a unit, there might be an expectation of higher quality. However, during my RV shopping experience a few years ago, including factory tours, I did not observe Dynamax quality (in the ISATA 3 and 4 lines) to be notably better than some other lower cost FR brands, and sometimes Dynamax lacked some expected features (in the ISATA 3 and 4 lines).


It's sad that your delivery experience did not go well. I'd put blame on both the manufacturer and the dealer in this case. I hope they both chip in to make this right.
Just for clarity...what year was your tour? (our last Isata 4 shipped mid 2019)

DO you recall what "expected features" were missing?
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Old 02-02-2023, 12:58 PM   #14
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Thank you for the response Brian.

The driver didn't use a vehicle at all, he ubered from our place to the train station to get a train to Portland for a flight home. I can confirm nothing was towed with it. The wire was in fact supposed to be on the rear white light on the lower right side (above and to the right of the hitch) I plugged it back in

The Couch, how should it be secured, what sort of bolts? I assume there are some large fender washers from underneath when it's open etc... Just wondering of this is something we can take car of or if I need to get it to the local dynamax dealer.

On the slide I did open and close it a couple of times and it was still there, the hole is large enough that I can put several fingers through it, it will easily allow critters through and there's a large draft, that's why I got down on my. knees and looked at it. Given that the dealer didn't take care of any of our punch-list items, I would doubt they did anything to adjust the slides, but I'll look from the outside and see if I can figure out how to put something in there to block it, I can see this one being missed, but on both slides I can easily wrap my fingers around the frame between the slide and the wall which sort of makes me feel the slides are not going all the way out, without another unit to compare I don't know if it's wrong or not. Both slides are this way.

On the wire underneath the bed, I can see the rollers that clear it, that's not the issue, the issue is that there's no cutout in the panel that goes over the water tank for access under the folding part of the bed, so that wire is pinched there, and the wire is just jacketed, I would at least have put some loom around it, and cut out a small circle in that panel to sit it in so it's not constantly having something rub against it while you're going down the road, the way it is now it'll fail pretty rapidly I'd expect. That part I find unacceptable, so we'll disagree on that. Also is that panel supposed to be secured in anyway? At the moment it sort of just rests there, and there's nothing holding it, so when you move the slide it tends to just fall off.
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Old 02-02-2023, 01:07 PM   #15
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OK, so the dangling plug, did have another dangling home. So it just came unplugged then...when you say rear white light? Docking light (lower bumper) I assume (not the white reverse light in the middle of the tail light.

Couch: only the seat belts have that fender washers. The sofa is lagged down into the floor. I would have to see what size fastener...it could be done pretty easily.

Yes...if you can wrap your hands around the slide fascia...they may not be going all the way out. You can adjust the stop settings by using our Youtube video. There is a seal on the slide fascia that should be compressed at least a little. It does not have to be flat....but should certainly be touching.

Ah...I see what you are saying now. We don't have to disagree...I was not exactly following what you were saying. That should for sure have a hole and grommet if it does not. The panel should be screw down. I will go check one now on line to show an example (and what they might be doing with that wire)
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Old 02-02-2023, 04:10 PM   #16
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OK, so the dangling plug, did have another dangling home. So it just came unplugged then...when you say rear white light? Docking light (lower bumper) I assume (not the white reverse light in the middle of the tail light.

Couch: only the seat belts have that fender washers. The sofa is lagged down into the floor. I would have to see what size fastener...it could be done pretty easily.

Yes...if you can wrap your hands around the slide fascia...they may not be going all the way out. You can adjust the stop settings by using our Youtube video. There is a seal on the slide fascia that should be compressed at least a little. It does not have to be flat....but should certainly be touching.

Ah...I see what you are saying now. We don't have to disagree...I was not exactly following what you were saying. That should for sure have a hole and grommet if it does not. The panel should be screw down. I will go check one now on line to show an example (and what they might be doing with that wire)
Yes likely the docking light, or perhaps a backup light, not sure, it's round and white.

If you can get a fastener size for the couch and it's just a lag bolt I'm guessing I can handle screwing it down, would save me a trip if that turns out to be the only issue that needs solving (haven't checked the water or other systems yet)

I looked at the video for the slide adjustment seems like you need to be Zaphod Beeblebrox (three hands) but I'll get it done, when you're setting the stops do you let it run until it whines a little, or do you try and have someone watching to say that far looks good?

On the panel screw down a photo would be amazing. Thank you Brian.
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Old 02-02-2023, 06:35 PM   #17
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On the slide, weíve become experts at this as weíve had living room slide issues for a long time. The videos make it sound harder than it is. Itís just a two finger operation. The hardest part is making sure the top finger/thumb presses down on both motors simultaneously. As to how far out or in, when the motors stop and you hear a click, let go of the motors buttons and take your finger off of the front panel retract or extend button.
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Yes likely the docking light, or perhaps a backup light, not sure, it's round and white.

If you can get a fastener size for the couch and it's just a lag bolt I'm guessing I can handle screwing it down, would save me a trip if that turns out to be the only issue that needs solving (haven't checked the water or other systems yet)

I looked at the video for the slide adjustment seems like you need to be Zaphod Beeblebrox (three hands) but I'll get it done, when you're setting the stops do you let it run until it whines a little, or do you try and have someone watching to say that far looks good?

On the panel screw down a photo would be amazing. Thank you Brian.
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Old 02-03-2023, 03:08 PM   #18
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Yes likely the docking light, or perhaps a backup light, not sure, it's round and white.

If you can get a fastener size for the couch and it's just a lag bolt I'm guessing I can handle screwing it down, would save me a trip if that turns out to be the only issue that needs solving (haven't checked the water or other systems yet)

I looked at the video for the slide adjustment seems like you need to be Zaphod Beeblebrox (three hands) but I'll get it done, when you're setting the stops do you let it run until it whines a little, or do you try and have someone watching to say that far looks good?

On the panel screw down a photo would be amazing. Thank you Brian.
Its not all that tough. In fact, I never remember the steps, so I cam normally watching my own video with one hand and resetting the slide with the other when it happens to me.

Photos of the lid screw down is attached.
1. I don't think you need that many screws. 4 would be plenty
2. On the one I took a picture of, they had drilled a hole.
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Old 02-03-2023, 04:10 PM   #19
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Its not all that tough. In fact, I never remember the steps, so I cam normally watching my own video with one hand and resetting the slide with the other when it happens to me.

Photos of the lid screw down is attached.
1. I don't think you need that many screws. 4 would be plenty
2. On the one I took a picture of, they had drilled a hole.
perfect thanks, that one it looks like they cut the board, and then hinged it so that you could get at the stuff for winterizing without having to pull the entire board, might have to do that. Also looks like that wire was passed through a hole further back, I can't do that without disconnecting the wire from the crimp it's in and then re-crimping it to whatever it's in, I don't think you used re-usable crimps on those ends there so I'll need to do something else. Mine comes up between the two boards there, thus my worry about wear.

Did you find any information on the couch attachment? I had a quick look at it, there's nothing attaching it to the rig at all, looks like you could screw through the front wooden cross-member but unclear if that would be sufficient, also I assume the seatbelts go through to the floor, I couldn't see where they vanished too it was late when I got to looking at that.
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Old 02-03-2023, 09:17 PM   #20
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So I just got outside and tried to reset the slide outs, they were going all the way out, I can still get my fingers behind the frame quite easily, thereís actually a wire back there so I donít think they can go out any further. Iíll have to investigate if thereís something missing in the rubber department that needs to be placed, my previous 3 rigs didnít have that big a gap around a slide anywhere so thatís sort of worrying.

Is the handle on the outside mid entry door supposed to be illuminated if so under what circumstances? Thereís a wire that goes through the wall and it looks like itís right about where the top of that handle is so Iím not sure, if itís supposed to light then nothing Iíve done so far has made it light up.
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