Isata 5: Timbren Suspension Enhancement System Review

[loftygoals]

I own a 2017 Isata 5 36DS. This is an early production unit that was optioned up with everything. It is the early heavier body construction, has solar, 4 house batteries, both fuel tanks, etc. Needless to say, it is very heavy. I have limited CCC and when loaded I'm at capacity on the rear axle and I'm slightly over on the front axle.

Overall, the ride is a bit harsher than I'd like. I can tell I'm hitting the bumpstops when I go over large dips or hit a pothole. The vibration level is also very high. The motorhome wallows through corners. If I turn into a corner a bit faster than I should in a motorhome, I have to open the wheel back up, wait for it to finish rolling over and settle, and then turn back in. Basically, the coach transfers so much weight and rolls so much that it crashes onto the bumpstops, bounces off, and then settles back down. Overall the ride reminds me of my old E450 motorhome, but it doesn't handle as well. I'd written this handling characteristic off as something I have to live with in a coach that's over 10 feet longer and twice as heavy as my old E450 coach, but more on this in a bit.

I've been eying the Kelderman full air suspension, but they are scheduling for mid-to-late summer for installs and I have a 30-day trip planned in June with multiple long weekends prior to that extended trip. Thus, I've been looking at options to improve the ride and handling quickly, easily, and inexpensively as a temporary improvement until I can get the air suspension installed.

I considered simple airbags, but I didn't want to invest the time running air lines and making a semi-perminant installation. Plus, I'd have a hard time resisting the temptation to add a compressor for in-cab adjustments. So I looked into something I've used on my pickup trucks in the past, Timbren Suspension Enhancement Systems (SES).

The Timbren SES is a hard rubber spring that installs in the location of the factory bump stops. They support the axle when loaded. They provide a progressive spring rate, so they get increasingly stiffer as more load is applied. They can help support the vehicle in turns, reducing body roll, and the SES can also have a damping effect improving ride characteristics (but I've never experienced this in the past.)

Looking on Timbren's website, they offer some options for the Ram 5500 Chassis.

In the front, I used:
TIMBREN SES SUSPENSION ENHANCEMENT SYSTEM SKU# DF5500HD - FRONT SEVERE SERVICE KIT

In the rear, I used:
TIMBREN SES SUSPENSION ENHANCEMENT SYSTEM SKU# DR5500 - REAR KIT

The installation was simple. I used the leveling jacks to raise the end I was working on. I didn't have to lift the tires off the ground in the front or the rear. I did use some heavy-duty jack stands to provide some additional safety before crawling under the coach. In the rear, you remove the 2 bolts per side that held the factory bumpstop in place and replace it with the SES kit. You have the option to install the 1" spacer or not. Given the load, I elected to use it. In the front, you pull the existing bumpstops out by hand and then push the SES kit into place--no tools required. It took me less than an hour to do both axles.

The finished product:
The first thing I notice is the ride height was increased. The rear sits 1/2" higher and the front seems about 2" higher. My coach always seemed to have a downhill rake to it, but now it looks level across the coach. Honestly, it makes the Ram cab look bigger and meaner!

Taking it for a test drive, I noticed that bigger bumps were smoothed out. It didn't eliminate them, but they feel less peaky. Turning my first corner, I noticed a huge difference. The coach didn't lean into it nearly as much--this brought a smile to my face!

I did notice one negative, though. The front feels a bit under-dampened. I feel with the Severe Service Kit, I need upgraded shocks for the low-speed dampening. The other option might be using the standard front kit instead of the Severe Service kit. This is a nit-picky observation from a guy that has years of experience setting up racing suspensions for road course race cars, so you might not even notice this.

To really put the new SES system to the test, I asked my wife to go for a ride. She rode sitting in the dinette with her laptop for a 50-mile trip. She couldn't believe the difference. The coach was much quieter and the ride massively improved. Previously, she would complain that she couldn't sit at the dinette and type an email on her laptop while we were in motion. Now, she could write a novel. She said this was the best improvement I've made to the coach in our nearly 4 years of ownership.

To be realistic, I'm sure a full air system would be better. That said, by shopping around online, I spent less than $750. That makes this a huge value. I may still convert to the Kelderman system, or I may just do the fronts, which include new shocks that I can install myself and is a lot cheaper than the rear 4 link solution. But for now, I have a coach that rides and handles better than my old E450 and it cost me very little to make the improvement.

If anyone else is using the Timbren SES kits, I'd love to hear how it is holding up. I'll update this thread with my experiences after I get more miles on the Timbren setup.

-bj

[Whalenss]

I also have a 2017 I5DS. Back then front axel is rated at 7,000 lbs before the front springs were changed and rating increased to 7,250 lbs.

The ride issues are the reason I worked with Kelderman on install of their system on the rig.

The system you mention sounds similar to Sumo springs being used on the Mercedes chassis. A progressive rate rubber to dampen the suspension travel. Sounds like the suspension is riding on it as you picked up front end lift.

Thanks for sharing.

[Ursusb]

This sounds very interesting, I did something very like this on a Navion I had about 16 years back, it helped a lot then.

I have noticed the front on our 30fw (2019 chassis) does ride a bit lower (about 2”) then the rear based on frame height, tends to raise the front tire off the ground often during leveling.

Based on your observations I’ve ordered the DF5500 (non HD) kit from etrailer (bit cheaper) since we are a somewhat shorter and lighter than the DS. I’ll wait on the rear kit until I see how the front kit works out for the ride.

[vlamgat]

One element on which you have not, probably have no need to comment is the improvement that the Timbren system makes to towing. I made this change to my E350 based, PSD Sportsmobile and it dramatically improved handling, sway, stability under heavy braking and ride height on that rig.

[Rc4mike]

Interesting system. Never heard of it before. I have a 2019 36 DS and have the same complaints about the rear. I love my front kellerman system, however. Would the SES system work along with the Firestone helper bags on the rear or would this be redundant? I’m about to try the Firestone bags

[vlamgat]

The Timbre and Firestone bags are mutually exclusive. One or the other. Firestone is a better all round option but different price point.

[loftygoals]

An update:

I did 500 miles this week and have some more thoughts:

After driving at Texas interstate speeds and across Oklahoma (which have some terrible roads if you not on the tollways), I can say this is a huge bang for the buck improvement. My wife kept saying that the ride is much, much, more comfortable. It is also a lot quieter--most of the rattles and squeaks are gone.

The 5500HDs are still a bit much at lower speeds but feel great on the highway. I have ordered a set of the standard 5500 fronts and a set of SumoSprings for the front. That will let me compare 3 different load rating setups: 2800#, 6000#, and 8000#.

Originally Posted by vlamgat

One element on which you have not, probably have no need to comment is the improvement that the Timbren system makes to towing. I made this change to my E350 based, PSD Sportsmobile and it dramatically improved handling, sway, stability under heavy braking and ride height on that rig.

I did the Timbren's when towing with my Excursion years ago, it made a huge difference. I frequently tow a 10,000# race car trailer behind me Isata 5. I will be towing it to a race this weekend. We'll see how the ride is with the trailer behind it.

Originally Posted by vlamgat

The Timbre and Firestone bags are mutually exclusive. One or the other. Firestone is a better all round option but different price point.

I'll agree that airbags are a better option and that helper bags and these rubber springs can't both be installed. For that matter, you can't do these with things like the Kelderman or LiquidSpring systems. These SES springs were just cheap, simple to install, and require zero maintenance. I was ready to spend $14k on a full air setup, but I can't imagine it being $13k better than where I'm at now. Maybe ignorance is bliss, so please if you have one of these nice full air setups, don't take me for a ride in your coach!

The only other thing I want is better shocks. I wish someone made a decent aftermarket shock for the Ram 5500.

-bj

[BLT4SPD]

Originally Posted by loftygoals

An update:

I did 500 miles this week and have some more thoughts:

After driving at Texas interstate speeds and across Oklahoma (which have some terrible roads if you not on the tollways), I can say this is a huge bang for the buck improvement. My wife kept saying that the ride is much, much, more comfortable. It is also a lot quieter--most of the rattles and squeaks are gone.

The 5500HDs are still a bit much at lower speeds but feel great on the highway. I have ordered a set of the standard 5500 fronts and a set of SumoSprings for the front. That will let me compare 3 different load rating setups: 2800#, 6000#, and 8000#.




I did the Timbren's when towing with my Excursion years ago, it made a huge difference. I frequently tow a 10,000# race car trailer behind me Isata 5. I will be towing it to a race this weekend. We'll see how the ride is with the trailer behind it.



I'll agree that airbags are a better option and that helper bags and these rubber springs can't both be installed. For that matter, you can't do these with things like the Kelderman or LiquidSpring systems. These SES springs were just cheap, simple to install, and require zero maintenance. I was ready to spend $14k on a full air setup, but I can't imagine it being $13k better than where I'm at now. Maybe ignorance is bliss, so please if you have one of these nice full air setups, don't take me for a ride in your coach!

The only other thing I want is better shocks. I wish someone made a decent aftermarket shock for the Ram 5500.

-bj

I feel your pain (no pun intended). I've been down a similar road as you and originally went with Sumos front and rear. I _liked_ them, but really wanted to try the full air-ride in the front to get an idea just how much better it was/is......and it is LIGHT years better. I think the ~$1600 Kelderman gets for the front air ride set-up is the best bang for the buck and if you have any experience with hand tools, I firmly believe it's a DIY job.

After that, I left the Sumos in the rear, but also installed a Hellwig "Big Wig" rear sway bar and the install on that was stupid simple and it made a noticable difference with the sway of the vehicle. Again, $300 and DIYing it with hand tools make this one a worthwhile upgrade.

After that, I really felt like I was leaving some reasonably price comfort on the table by not having air in the back, so I swapped the Sumos for Firestone Ride-Rites. ~$400 and DIY'd in the driveway and the ride did end up being quite a bit better than the Sumos. Not nearly as smoothed out as the Kelderman in the front, but certainly better than the Sumos.


Overall, I am pretty happy with where it's at in terms of ride comfort vs. $$$$. If the Kelderman 4-link rear was a tad more DIY friendly, I'd jump on it, but I'm not willing to take that plunge.....yet.

[BLT4SPD]

Originally Posted by loftygoals

The only other thing I want is better shocks. I wish someone made a decent aftermarket shock for the Ram 5500.

-bj

There is a guy on the Ram 4500/5500 Facebook group that is running Fox Remote Reservoir shocks from a 3500 up front and claims they fit without issue or modification.

He also claims to be running some Kenworth shock in the back and only had to press out the Kenworth bushings and press in some different bushings that had the correct I.D. for the Ram mounting studs on the frame and leaf springs. I'm waiting to hear back from hm on what part numbers he used.

[loftygoals]

Originally Posted by BLT4SPD

I feel your pain (no pun intended). I've been down a similar road as you and originally went with Sumos front and rear. I _liked_ them, but really wanted to try the full air-ride in the front to get an idea just how much better it was/is......and it is LIGHT years better. I think the ~$1600 Kelderman gets for the front air ride set-up is the best bang for the buck and if you have any experience with hand tools, I firmly believe it's a DIY job.

I considered installing the Kelderman fronts. Honestly, I was being cheap and lazy. I've owned an automotive performance shop for over a decade. I can turn wrenches with the best of them and have everything I'd ever need to work on these trucks accept a lift big enough to pick them up.

The other thing that has me cheaping-out is that I am planning to upgrade to a Force HD or DX3 soon. I've got a month-long trip planned in the I5 this summer, and then I'm going to get serious about selling. I'm upgrading because I really want to be able to tow a stacker so I can take two cars with me on race weekends. I also want to move to a bunkhouse floor plan because my son likes to bring friends with us when we go camping or to the race track. When I first bought the I5, it was mainly about going to the race track, but now we use it more for family trips than race trips.

----------------

So I just finished the 500 mile return trip today. I certainly feel a lot fresher at the end of the trip with the Timbren's installed. I'm still really happy for the improvement considering it was only an hour of labor and a $750 investment.

I'm happy enough with the setup that I'd leave it as is, but given that the fronts take 5-10 minutes to swap, I thought I'd play with different rates to see the ideal 750 bucks or less solution can be found. The SumoSprings get here Wednesday, so I'll be able to swap them on before I drive the I5 to the track this weekend. They have 35% of the capacity, so they should feel quite a bit different than the SES 5500HD kit. I still think the right setup is going to be the SES 5500 (non-HD) kit.

-bj

[Ursusb]

Installed the DF5500 non HD Timbrens today, easy peasy install, before and after front measurements at the wheel well shows I gained 1 1/4” on height.

This is a 2019 Ram chassis 2021 30fw, so a bit lighter all around then the 36, now for a trip, May 9th for a week to OK from NM, I40 for most of it but plenty of secondary roads etc, will report back here if any truly noticeable improvements on ride quality. If there is a noticeable improvement I’ll also install the rear T’s as well.

Normally don’t ride in the back but did notice enough rough riding that clothes and even the whole rod once, would fall to the bottom of the closet, not sure just the front T’s will help that but ever hopeful!

[loftygoals]

Originally Posted by Ursusb

Installed the DF5500 non HD Timbrens today...

Thanks for the update! I meant to update this thread as well. I towed my 24' trailer last weekend. It wasn't fully loaded, but I was probably towing ~9000 lbs. My Isata 5 rides noticeably better when towing. With the 5500HD's still installed up front, the front ride smoothed out. Although I received the new SumoSprings to try on the front axle, I could not bring myself to install them. I had planned to tow to the race track with the 5500HD's on the front and then swap them while at the track so I could tow with the SumoSprings on the return trip for a back-to-back comparison.

I have a little over a month until my next trip. I plan to do some maintenance before prior, so I'll install the SumoSprings and do some driving to see what I think. I'll report back after the test.

-bj

[mjbenedict]

Originally Posted by loftygoals

Thanks for the update! I meant to update this thread as well. I towed my 24' trailer last weekend. It wasn't fully loaded, but I was probably towing ~9000 lbs. My Isata 5 rides noticeably better when towing. With the 5500HD's still installed up front, the front ride smoothed out. Although I received the new SumoSprings to try on the front axle, I could not bring myself to install them. I had planned to tow to the race track with the 5500HD's on the front and then swap them while at the track so I could tow with the SumoSprings on the return trip for a back-to-back comparison.

I have a little over a month until my next trip. I plan to do some maintenance before prior, so I'll install the SumoSprings and do some driving to see what I think. I'll report back after the test.

-bj

Thank you for your experience. I considered the factory install of Keldermans until I saw how much weight was robbed from the OCCC. These don't look like they add weight given they replace the bump stops. I'll be interested to see everyone's experience once you/they get more road time. Mine is the "lighter", newer model of the 36ds and I don't have much issue with the ride nor do I experience the roll you mentioned previously. There are times on rough roads that I can tell the bump stops are being used. The height would help on my driveway given I come very close to dragging the back end when entering it.

[mjbenedict]

Curious, given the rear axle is rated at 13,500lbs, will these handle that extra weight given the 12,000lb capacity?

[mjbenedict]

So I pulled the trigger and bought the timbren front and rear SES. I bought the standard front and installed on my 36DS today. Wow, what a difference. Thanks for the idea and review! The standard front is not harsh and they both reduced body roll, reduced looseness in steering, and made the ride much smoother. I also like that it adds little weight to rig.

Thanks again!

[loftygoals]

Originally Posted by mjbenedict

Curious, given the rear axle is rated at 13,500lbs, will these handle that extra weight given the 12,000lb capacity?

Well, there is more to consider in the axle's ability to carry the weight. Technically, there may be other mechanical components that might not be up to additional load. The most important factor to look at is the dual tire load capacity. I am on Toyo M143 tire in 225/70R19.5 with a load rating of 3750 per tire in a dual configuration. This indicates that the tire can handle 3750 x 4 or 15,000 lbs.

The other thing to remember is exceeding axle weight is illegal in most states.

With the disclaimers out of the way, if you are going to exceed the listed capacity, I do think these would help carry the load.

Originally Posted by mjbenedict

So I pulled the trigger and bought the timbren...

I'm glad they are working out for you. I just towed a 9,000 lbs trailer 550 miles this weekend and I'm still very happy with my SES setup. I'm leaving soon for a month-long trip and I'm very glad I'll have the SES smoothing out the ride. I still think the value proposition of this upgrade is really great. The amount of improvement vs. the low cost makes it a no-brainer unless you are ponying up for the full air suspension.

-bj

[loftygoals]

mjbenedict, I just noticed in your signature that you have a 2020 Ram 1500 Limited. That's what we have, too. We love our 1500!


This was me checking everything out before hitting the Interstate for the first time with the 1500 in tow.

[mjbenedict]

Originally Posted by loftygoals

mjbenedict, I just noticed in your signature that you have a 2020 Ram 1500 Limited. That's what we have, too. We love our 1500!


This was me checking everything out before hitting the Interstate for the first time with the 1500 in tow.

You must be a very classy and intelligent person

If you’re looking for a rack for your bed that allows ramboxes and tonneau try https://dethloffmfg.com/shop/contour...019-57-rambox/

They have pictures of my truck with kayak on top given I was one of the first to buy and use this way. They’re out of Oregon and shipped to me in PA. I have no affiliation but like to post given these racks are hard to find.

[Lvnthedream]

Originally Posted by mjbenedict

So I pulled the trigger and bought the timbren front and rear SES. I bought the standard front and installed on my 36DS today. Wow, what a difference. Thanks for the idea and review! The standard front is not harsh and they both reduced body roll, reduced looseness in steering, and made the ride much smoother. I also like that it adds little weight to rig.

Thanks again!

Does the front raise the RV some? I'm looking to raise it maybe 2". Good to hear it improved your ride.

[mjbenedict]

I did not measure but the front definitely sits higher.