SunSeeker MBS 2400W sprouts a Toad!

[Rkloud9]

Multiple factors have come together in our travel adventures to lead us to add a toad vehicle to our rig. Although we have been quit happy traveling with the Beast, our travel style has been more focused on daily treks from one site to the next in the process of getting to specific destinations for events and family visits, with few stays at any one place for more than one day. Although enjoyable, a lot of time is spent each day finding a camping spot and setting up, then packing up and heading out the next day. If we don't start early, we often find ourselves arriving late at a new place and scrambling with the docking process. And starting early can create tension between the two of us, as often we do not have the same priorities. In 2016 we covered 14000 miles in 80 days, 21 days of which were spent in family driveways. So we probably were driving about 60 days to cover those miles, about 230 per day.

We are now going to fundamentally change how we roll, with the plan to stay at least 2 nights in any campground we like, and try to minimize specific planning as much as possible to keep our choices as "spur of the moment" as possible. The toad will allow quick travel to points of interest nearby, and make it easier to travel to congested spots. In a National Park like Big Bend, we will be able to set up a base camp and drive to places where even the SunSeeker is not allowed.

We are now about 14 days into our latest trek, and have visited 3 sets of relatives in Alabama and Texas. We had left the Beast in Texas back in late November, flying back up to Chicago for the holidays. While up there we shopped for the new toad, and settled on a Chevy Spark. With all the end of year sales incentives the price was terrific, and we were surprised at how well this tiny vehicle (about 13' long and 2300 lbs) handles and rides. Cynthia and I are pretty old school drivers, and going with a stick shift was no big deal for us, so this car is a natural "4 wheels down" solution. If you are considering a similar move, here are some things we have learned:

- Setting up the car with tow plate (front hitch) and the RV with the tow bars is more costly than we imagined. A call to our dealer yielded a rough estimate of $2000-2500, and the opinion that such a small vehicle would not need a braking system. Our initial feeling was that all this stuff needed to be professionally installed, so we adjusted our expectations accordingly. But when we got the car and asked for a real quote, the price was $3300, with another $1400 for a brake controller (a gadget the senses when the RV brakes are applied, and presses the toad's brake pedal at the same time). Doing some research, I found that the majority of states, especially out West, require a braking system for cars over 1500 lbs, so this was a needed add-on.

- Like everything else on earth these days, all the hardware is available on-line, with videos on YouTube that show how to do the installation. Although we were reluctant to consider the "do-it-yourself" approach, saving $2300 is pretty persuasive. The good news for us is that one of the relatives in Texas has a pretty nicely equipped garage, with the "positive farmer attitude"... so, online I went, and all the gear was loaded into the toad and away we went!

- Installing the tow gear on the new car was actually pretty easy, especially with the farmer's helping hand and array of tools. Mounting the tow bars on the RV was really simple, as it is pre-assembled, and fits on the existing hitch. We used the Blue Ox 6500 lbs towbar and Spark-specific base plate.

- For the brake controller we went with the Blue Ox Patriot unit, which is also pretty easy, as the main unit has an internal inertial sensor that actuates the car brake, with a radio control that goes in the RV cab to advise the system status and provide a manual brake actuation switch. There is also a break-away switch (applies the brakes to the toad if it somehow breaks free from the RV). This requires running a cable from the front bumper to the driver's seat in the toad (again, pretty easy).

- Also required is a connection from the RV to the Toad that actuates the Toad's rear running, brake, and turn signals. Here I ran into some serious problems... Blue Ox offers an accessory kit that include hook up cables and wiring kits to get the lighting working, and the RV has a nice 7 pin plug to make all this work. But, after installing and testing the light kit, I plugged it into the RV only to get intermittent tail light flashes and a blown fuse. Thinking the infamous Curt controller the culprit, and being 800 miles away from my dealer, I installed a new Curt controller. Still no luck. Testing the RV plug, I found 13 volts of negative juice in
4 of the pins, and 31 volts in a 5th pi
-


Bob & Cynthia
2017 SunSeeker MBS 2400W
Sent from my iPad using Forest River Forums

[Rkloud9]

Having trouble finishing this post due to weird input problems...

- 4 pins on the RV's 7 pin plug tested negative 13 volts, one tested 31 volts... ended up splitting the output of the Curt controller and running this directly to a new plug, after removing the crazy offensive original plug. LOTS of time wasted on this issue!

Our first run with Sparky was a couple of days ago on pretty ideal, fairly flat Texas highways between Dallas and Livingston. The first fuel stop with the extra 19 feet of vehicle and hitch was a bit unnerving, as we have heard many bad "gas station" stories, but all in all it was pretty smooth. Interestingly, we got 14.3 actual mpg , not much different than our usual 15mpg average. I am sure hills/mountains/altitude will make a big difference.

Happy trails all!


Bob & Cynthia
2017 SunSeeker MBS 2400W
Sent from my iPad using Forest River Forums

[raptor]

Hi Bob & Cynthia,
I have been thinking to get small car to tow too. Thanks you for spending times to post your experience for us to read.

[Rkloud9]

Today we covered about 230 miles with Sparky in tow, and got 12.9 mpg. This is more like what we expected dragging that little car. Got in late to Goliad State Park in Texas, and had to scramble to get set up before dark. We then headed to town via the Spark, as we had not gotten provisions yet. Pretty cool place, softer getting the groceries we had dinner at the Hanging Tree restaurant... a place wit both character and characters! Love it!

Without the car we would have had to stop at the store before going to the campground, which would have meant a later, darker arrival. So far so good!


Bob & Cynthia
2017 SunSeeker MBS 2400W
Sent from my iPad using Forest River Forums

[cpottey]

Hi Bob and Cynthia,

I also bought a Chevy Spark as a toad. I got it last summer when it was on sale for $9,800 and I has a GM Card rebate of $3,800, so I ended up paying $6K. It seemed like a good price for a new car. I haven't towed it yet but we have been driving it around and it is a nice little car. I ordered a base plate, tow bar and wiring kit online and had a local shop install them last month. I haven't added a breaking system yet. I am thinking i may try towing it without a braking system to see how it handles since it is so light. A lot of trailers that weight that amount don't have brakes. There are only 3 states that require brakes above 1,500 pounds, California, Nevada and Idaho. (New York requires brakes above 1,000 pounds) However, I live in Nevada and travel to California more than anyplace else. Even if it handles OK I may add brakes to be compliant with the law. I like the Roadmaster Invisibrake system because you don't have to do anything once it is installed but the Blue Ox Patriot looks much easier to install. Good luck with your new toad.

[Quest9914]

We just installed Blue Ox gear. Went with Brake Buddy braking - combines direct full and proportionate braking.
We has 12 volt power come from coach. Installed a 12 volt plug inside tow vehicle on that circuit. No power from toad.
Instead of the wiring kit, we had diodes installed in toad lights. No drilling and added bulbs. I liked having a professional service do the attachments and wiring. I paid about $425 for everything at a local truck and van shop. Camping World wanted $1,000. What was nice is to have been able to supply all of the hardware bought on line at big savings.

[Jandrewwright4]

Rkloud9: Great post thanks. I too have a '16MBS and just bought a "13 Spark, also a manual. The guy I bought it from had set it up to tow behind a class A with a Blue Ox Alpha tow bar, but no brake. I had an Evenbrake from a previous RV so I had that set up, since even though it doesn't weigh much, I figure it might be a lot behind the MBS on hills and all. Haven't towed it yet, but really like driving the little car around town. We're planning a trip soon from central Florida to New Orleans, pretty flat so we'll see.

Here's a question you might can answer. According to the Spark manual, we need to turn the key to ACC to release the steering wheel. But the mechanic who set up the brake showed me how simply inserting the key in the inginition releases the steering wheel, which alleviates the drain on the Spark battery during long days behind the rig. Of course the worry would be for some reason the steering wheel would lock while in tow without my knowledge. Anyway, do you know anything about that?

I'll look forward to your posts on how it all goes. Thanks

[Nancyc7]

This is our next project. I received tire temp and pressure monitors for Christmas, maybe I'll get a tow package for my birthday. We thought we could go a while without a tow vehicle but first time out we wanted to bike on a nearby trail. To get to the trail, there were a couple miles of curvy roads with no shoulder and fair amt of traffic. Because I was so chicken, we pulled up stakes and drove MH to the trail.
We have a Dodge Dakota pickup my husband is planning on towing but I'm concerned it will be too heavy, we have to weigh it soon. Hmmm, can you put a bike rack on a Spark? And kayak racks?

[Rkloud9]

We have a 2017 Spark with the manual transmission, and the user-manual says to set the key to the accessory position for being towed, but, near as I can tell, there is no wheel lock. So far we are running with the key in and at "acc", as maybe there is another reason for this setting. We have the Blue Ox Patriot brake controller, and on an 8 hour run it killed Sparky's battery. We need to get the 12 volt source from the Sprinter working to solve this problem. In the meantime, on a couple of longer days we have run without the brake controller... the car is really small and the Sprinter seems to handle stopping pretty well. But we will feel more secure with the controller running.

The Sparky Toad has been a real plus for us... we have been on the road with it now for about 14 days, 7 transit days moving from East of Dallas, through Houston, over to Big Bend NP, and now heading back towards Dallas, and 7 "in-place" days. We have used the Spark almost every day, and we are able to get to so many more places. In Big Bend there was a major road with a 24' maximum length (really tight hairpins, 10% grades), and another with "22 ft max, no dual wheels" (narrow, single lane, rough surface). The Sprinter could have handled the first one with white knuckles, and if we would of tried the second, it would probably still be there. No problem for the Spark. A 4WD toad would be the ideal solution, but much heavier and way more $. Towing Sparky was a bit stressful at first, but we are getting used to it. Overall it seems to be costing us about 2 MPG on average (13 mpg with, 15 without).

I took the back seats out of the Spark (really easy), which creates a nice storage bay. One bike fits inside with one wheel removed. I suppose it would be possible to add a bike rack or a kayak, but it is a really small car (less than 13', 2300 lbs) with a total carrying capacity of about 600 lbs.

Happy travels all!

[Jandrewwright4]

Thanks for the update. I suspected the toad might drain the battery on long days. And, it makes sense the Spark would not stress the MBS brakes to much, especially on mostly flat roads. I like your idea of not using the brake all the time. I might try that. I typically get 15MPG so I'll watch to see the change with the toad. Safe travels and thanks for the post.