Tire shop changing rear tires lifting use the rear axle

[Livin the dream]

Just a heads up a big name tire chain lifted the rear tires using the rear axle differential . Well that didn’t go well. The damaged the rear differential cover . I did not realize it till I noticed oil on the driveway. I am glad I crawled under . Thanks to Atlantic City m b dealer. They are going the extra distance to get us on the road. Hats off to Tina . They should have it fixed in a few days. $525 later.ouch.I contacted the tire dealers head office to start a conversation.
2018 sunseeker mBs 24oo w
Lesson learned be careful who works on m b part of rig. I asked, several times if they could handle it. On a side note they installed the inner stems incorrectly set the tire pressure at 70 psi and the inner stems would not allow you to add or reduce tire pressure in addition charged for tpms inspection which I do not have .
Thanks

[chriscowles]

Originally Posted by Livin the dream

... in addition charged for tpms inspection which I do not have.

They had to inspect it to be sure.

[robo44]

Originally Posted by Livin the dream

Just a heads up a big name tire chain lifted the rear tires using the rear axle differential . Well that didn’t go well. The damaged the rear differential cover . I did not realize it till I noticed oil on the driveway. I am glad I crawled under . Thanks to Atlantic City m b dealer. They are going the extra distance to get us on the road. Hats off to Tina . They should have it fixed in a few days. $525 later.ouch.I contacted the tire dealers head office to start a conversation.
2018 sunseeker mBs 24oo w
Lesson learned be careful who works on m b part of rig. I asked, several times if they could handle it. On a side note they installed the inner stems incorrectly set the tire pressure at 70 psi and the inner stems would not allow you to add or reduce tire pressure in addition charged for tpms inspection which I do not have .
Thanks

Id be interested in the initials or name of the "big name tire chain" so i could stay away

[TitanMike]

Was "Big" part of the name? Or was it the store famous for jacking up everything with floor jacks under the differential when rear wheel drive and has the initials D. T.?

[Livin the dream]

No big was not in the name I’d prefer not to mention the franchise yet till I speak to the head office . I plan to bring the m b bill to him as s soon as it’s done and forward all copies to their office. Just want a good paper trail. It’s in nj

[Blackrock]

I have probably jacked up a couple hundred vehicles by the differential pumpkin in my career as a mechanic. I always have tried to get the cup of the jack centered properly but there is always one that gets wrinkled. Been lucky most time to be able to beat it back down with a hammer.

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by Blackrock

I have probably jacked up a couple hundred vehicles by the differential pumpkin in my career as a mechanic. I always have tried to get the cup of the jack centered properly but there is always one that gets wrinkled. Been lucky most time to be able to beat it back down with a hammer.

How did that work for you with the cast aluminum covers widely used in the last 20 years?

Might get away with a "Punkin lift" on an unloaded pickup but good luck escaping an alignment issue on a loaded truck or motorhome.

[Blackrock]

Originally Posted by TitanMike

How did that work for you with the cast aluminum covers widely used in the last 20 years?

Might get away with a "Punkin lift" on an unloaded pickup but good luck escaping an alignment issue on a loaded truck or motorhome.

I'm smart enough that if I ever saw an aftermarket ricky racer aluminum cover I would add a wooden block to the jack. But in reality I worked for a large state fleet with pretty much all of the generic big 3 makers. The ones I had to watch out for were the larger trucks with the drain plug right in the bottom. I've been retired since 2010 so I never saw that many aluminum diff covers in general use.

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by Blackrock

I'm smart enough that if I ever saw an aftermarket ricky racer aluminum cover I would add a wooden block to the jack. But in reality I worked for a large state fleet with pretty much all of the generic big 3 makers. The ones I had to watch out for were the larger trucks with the drain plug right in the bottom. I've been retired since 2010 so I never saw that many aluminum diff covers in general use.

OE on my pickup. No special order or aftermarket install.

[Larry-NC]

Originally Posted by Blackrock

I have probably jacked up a couple hundred vehicles by the differential pumpkin in my career as a mechanic. I always have tried to get the cup of the jack centered properly but there is always one that gets wrinkled. Been lucky most time to be able to beat it back down with a hammer.

When I was doing this, back in the 1960s, the differential/rear axle housing was one solid piece of cast iron, and jacking on the pumpkin was standard practice. We even kept an old topless oil drum near the drive-on lift, and when doing a brake job we would raise the car, slide the drum under the pumpkin, and lower the car until the wheels were a few inches free of the lift. Then we could do the brakes while standing at chest level instead of kneeling.

But now the differentials are not made of monolithic cast iron. It's a cast iron pumpkin and two cast iron outboard bearing hubs at the springs, with thin tubing connecting each hub to the center. If you jack one of these new-style cars (or trucks) in the center, you will definitely bend something.

[ken64k]

Most of the big name tire chains hire people who do not know what they are doing. They are shown how to change a car tire and that is it and even at that they think it is ok to use an impack wrench to tighten the lug nuts. No idea how to work on a truck.

[Mikegjax]

I believe MB's service manual says DO NOT USE the axle to raise the tire from the ground.

[aircommuter]

Not all differentials were made with covers. But at any rate lifting by the way described is a definite no for a loaded vehicle which of course would apply to an RV. When lifting vehicles one must follow manufacturers publications and be trained to do so. Obviously this was not done here.
The other way is to use some uncommon sense and look at the design of the vehicles structure. Then decide what is the best method and if they are not equipped to do it the best way simply tell the customer and they can have it done where it will be done correctly.

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by aircommuter

Not all differentials were made with covers. But at any rate lifting by the way described is a definite no for a loaded vehicle which of course would apply to an RV. When lifting vehicles one must follow manufacturers publications and be trained to do so. Obviously this was not done here.
The other way is to use some uncommon sense and look at the design of the vehicles structure. Then decide what is the best method and if they are not equipped to do it the best way simply tell the customer and they can have it done where it will be done correctly.

Every vehicle manufacturer has designated "jacking points" and they are published in both owner's manual and service guides.

Why not just follow manufacturer's instructions rather than just doing what you 'think" is OK?

[aircommuter]

That is true depending upon the age of the vehicle and the availability of said information. Along with one's desire to take the time to research the information. It could also have to do with the shop's age and lift design which would make them turn the job away.
In this case yes for the info, in older vehicles not so much. I was hoisting cars in the shop I had in 1959. At that time I never saw published lifting info in those days and not for some time later.

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by aircommuter

That is true depending upon the age of the vehicle and the availability of said information. Along with one's desire to take the time to research the information. It could also have to do with the shop's age and lift design which would make them turn the job away.
In this case yes for the info, in older vehicles not so much. I was hoisting cars in the shop I had in 1959. At that time I never saw published lifting info in those days and not for some time later.

I started in the Auto Service industry back in the summer of 1961.

A company named Check-Chart published service guides that showed EVERYTHING needed to perform Lube/Tire service on vehicles. Jacking points, number and location of Xerk fittings, type of lubricant and quantity, all on two opposing pages. Even printed on "grease proof paper" Throughout my career (43 years) shops had either Check-Chart books, Chilton, Motor Manuals, Mitchell, etc. Starting in the 80's this information all started to be provided on digital devices.

Information is available if one wants to look it up. Some is "subscription only" but most shops figure it's worth the cost to avoid problems.

[lacamastraveler]

Thank you Livin the Dream for your post. I had an appointment scheduled for the next day at a national name tire company. After reading your post I printed the “jack point” instruction page from my manual and gave it to the service manager. They do a lot of Sprinters so it probably would not have been a problem, but I felt more confident knowing the tech had the specific instructions stapled to the work order.

On a similar subject I always have the shop show me the new tires and read the manufacture date to me. Tires should be changed six years after their manufacture date and I don’t want to purchase tires that have been in the warehouse for a year. The Michelin’s I had installed were manufactured last month.

[Larry-NC]

Originally Posted by lacamastraveler

Thank you Livin the Dream for your post. I had an appointment scheduled for the next day at a national name tire company. After reading your post I printed the “jack point” instruction page from my manual and gave it to the service manager. They do a lot of Sprinters so it probably would not have been a problem, but I felt more confident knowing the tech had the specific instructions stapled to the work order.

On a similar subject I always have the shop show me the new tires and read the manufacture date to me. Tires should be changed six years after their manufacture date and I don’t want to purchase tires that have been in the warehouse for a year. The Michelin’s I had installed were manufactured last month.

Michelin claims theirs are good for ten years. I've only had Michelins on one vehicle, but the were far superior to the Firestones that preceded them. The Firestone tires were on the vehicle for a few weeks after which I returned to the independent tire store where I got them and insisted on a better tire. (The store agreed to replace the tires if I paid the price difference.)

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by Larry-NC

Michelin claims theirs are good for ten years. I've only had Michelins on one vehicle, but the were far superior to the Firestones that preceded them. The Firestone tires were on the vehicle for a few weeks after which I returned to the independent tire store where I got them and insisted on a better tire. (The store agreed to replace the tires if I paid the price difference.)

There is no standard for tire replacement by age. Also no law or regulation.

I sat in staff meetings where this subject was discussed back in he 90's. It wasn't so much that the tires were "rotting on the shelves" or becoming unsafe as much as it was centered on how modern tires were "lasting too long".

In the early 60's a premium tire was considered good for 10-15 thousand miles. Sales were good. Radials showed up in the 70's and took over starting in the 80's. By then the standard for mileage expectancy was 35 thousand miles with some a lot more. Now there are tires sold with well over 60 K miles "mileage warranties".

In the tire industry a better wearing tire means fewer sales opportunities although proliferation of cars/trucks does make up for much of the reduced opportunites.

The concensus around our table was that getting people to replace tires more often might be a good "sales stimulus" and what better way to accomplish this than some kind of an "expiration date". Manufacturers and regulators haven't created one and so far only "recommendations" amplified by "the internet" have been the result.

It still boils down to starting with a good tire (they DO cost more), proper care and maintenance, not overloading, overspeeding, and keeping inflated, and is there really an expiration date?



For years people relied on what the tire actually told us when it came to determining a replacement time. Cracks, damage, wear, etc did a fine job. I had one set of tires that went well over 15 years before I traded the car. Still had around half the tread left.

Tires fail today more due to improper use and lack of maintenance but what's new. Bigger engines lead to greater speeds (speed limit signs are viewed merely as suggested speeds) and maintenance? Back in the day people checked their oil, water, and tire pressure before starting each day on a trip with their RV. Today, if it starts and has fuel in the tank it's good to go for way too many.

I think tire manufacturers would be overjoyed if regulations were enacted requiring tire replacement after 4-6years. Don't see it happening.

[SSmbs]

As for the issue with the dealer putting the psi at 70 I run 72 in the rear and 70 in the front.