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Old 04-27-2021, 02:22 PM   #41
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Outlets

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Originally Posted by Wes Tausend View Post
...

Thanks Larry. I didn't ever read what the specs actually were. By observation, it just seemed chancy that more than one would ever be correct. That answers why an RV manufacturer might do such a thing.

The assembly my buddy had, vee'd out from the first wire which is actually properly trapped in it's clamp. The second, and for sure the third, were held very loosely in an ever-widening vee.

I don't remember how he fixed it, since the original outlet appeared to be permanently distorted that way. He might have replaced the outlet since I'd mentioned that I found the identical item in a local RV parts center.

I'd used an identical new outlet, found locally, in my under-cabinet kitchen add because that's about all that fits in this shallow, commonly used wiring cavity.

Wes
The outlets are about $11 on Amazon, although I've only seen white there. The professional tool for assembling these is a few hundred dollars. I imagine you might be able to assemble one with hand tools, but I suppose you could slip and distort the contact exactly as you describe. Here's the tool for amateurs. a video of the professional tool.
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Old 04-27-2021, 04:34 PM   #42
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I believe all of these questions are answered in previous posts
Are you sure? Read post 35.
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Old 04-27-2021, 08:04 PM   #43
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Are you sure? Read post 35.
Iím pretty sure. I read all the posts.
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Old 04-27-2021, 09:04 PM   #44
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Iím pretty sure. I read all the posts.
As do I. Several times. He will let us know if he needs more help.
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Old 04-28-2021, 02:45 PM   #45
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Still don't have it solved. I do know that at that connector that is below the cabinet that the problem exists somewhere between the breaker box and that connector.

I'm convinced that there's an outlet or some other device somewhere in line between those two points that has failed. I don't believe it is a physical cabling problem. I'm now trying to follow the cabling to see if I can find where it goes deep within the bowels of the RV. Very frustrating.
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Old 04-28-2021, 02:54 PM   #46
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Well darn. I'm out of ideas. Good luck tracing the circuit.
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Old 04-28-2021, 03:01 PM   #47
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I may have missed it but did you check continuity on the cable between the outlet and the distribution panel to confirm a break or loose junction in the cable?

Take a look in the area around the microwave and see if you can find another outlet that might be on the same circuit. Perhaps an over range vent. It would have to be 130 volts. One way to check would be to turn the microwave breaker off and the check every device / outlet to see if you can find one that is not working.
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Old 04-28-2021, 04:04 PM   #48
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I may have missed it but did you check continuity on the cable between the outlet and the distribution panel to confirm a break or loose junction in the cable?

Take a look in the area around the microwave and see if you can find another outlet that might be on the same circuit. Perhaps an over range vent. It would have to be 130 volts. One way to check would be to turn the microwave breaker off and the check every device / outlet to see if you can find one that is not working.
I shut down the power, connected a long lead wire from the white (neutral) at the outlet and ran it back to a place right next to by breaker box. I tested for continuity using the long lead wire on one probe and the other probe directly on the neutral bar. I also disconnected neutral wire from the bar and tested it directly - one end to the other - but no continuity.

The only other outlet that is on the slide is the GFCI kitchen outlets and they are definitely on a separate breaker (confirmed).

Following the wire back from the outlet, I see it come out of the slide wall on the floor underneath the cabinet and in to that Molex connector I mentioned earlier. Continuing from the Molex connector back it goes from a 12-2 Romex wire to a round black wire that disappears into the coach somewhere and eventually shows up at the breaker box.

My volt meter shows 120vac on the black and the ground. Nothing shows up on white.
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Old 04-28-2021, 04:53 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by Jim1521 View Post
I shut down the power, connected a long lead wire from the white (neutral) at the outlet and ran it back to a place right next to by breaker box. I tested for continuity using the long lead wire on one probe and the other probe directly on the neutral bar. I also disconnected neutral wire from the bar and tested it directly - one end to the other - but no continuity.

The only other outlet that is on the slide is the GFCI kitchen outlets and they are definitely on a separate breaker (confirmed).

Following the wire back from the outlet, I see it come out of the slide wall on the floor underneath the cabinet and in to that Molex connector I mentioned earlier. Continuing from the Molex connector back it goes from a 12-2 Romex wire to a round black wire that disappears into the coach somewhere and eventually shows up at the breaker box.

My volt meter shows 120vac on the black and the ground. Nothing shows up on white.
How is the Romex connected to the black round cord? (commonly called SO cord)
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Old 04-28-2021, 04:56 PM   #50
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How is the Romex connected to the black round cord? (commonly called SO cord)
I didn't word that too well. The 12-2 Romex wiring connects through the Molex connector, to the SO cord as shown in post 15

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Old 04-28-2021, 05:11 PM   #51
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Carefully

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Still don't have it solved. I do know that at that connector that is below the cabinet that the problem exists somewhere between the breaker box and that connector.

I'm convinced that there's an outlet or some other device somewhere in line between those two points that has failed. I don't believe it is a physical cabling problem. I'm now trying to follow the cabling to see if I can find where it goes deep within the bowels of the RV. Very frustrating.
Jim,

I'm CAREFULLY reading what you wrote. If I understand it, you unplugged the connectors from one another, and then measured resistance from the neutral bus in the panel to the mating side of the connector. And that you DID NOT measure from the crimp side of the connector.

How do you know that the problem isn't inside the connector? The connector is like those in the outlets--one of those insulation displacement connectors that only contacts the wire at two tiny places. The original power surge could easily have burned this up--the current density at the contact points is extremely high.

Do this non-destructive test. Get a hatpin--a sturdy straight pin. Press it through the neutral wire insulation so it contacts the conductor, near the connector. Now measure resistance from there to the neutral bus at the panel. It should be close to 0 ohms. You will have isolated the problem to the connector. Cut it off and replace it--or cut both ends off and use another connection scheme.

You did a great job of isolating this problem. Not sure why you have stalled this close to the finish line. Maybe you just couldn't visualize a failure at the crimp point.
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Old 04-28-2021, 05:26 PM   #52
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Jim,

I'm CAREFULLY reading what you wrote. If I understand it, you unplugged the connectors from one another, and then measured resistance from the neutral bus in the panel to the mating side of the connector. And that you DID NOT measure from the crimp side of the connector.

How do you know that the problem isn't inside the connector? The connector is like those in the outlets--one of those insulation displacement connectors that only contacts the wire at two tiny places. The original power surge could easily have burned this up--the current density at the contact points is extremely high.

Do this non-destructive test. Get a hatpin--a sturdy straight pin. Press it through the neutral wire insulation so it contacts the conductor, near the connector. Now measure resistance from there to the neutral bus at the panel. It should be close to 0 ohms. You will have isolated the problem to the connector. Cut it off and replace it--or cut both ends off and use another connection scheme.

You did a great job of isolating this problem. Not sure why you have stalled this close to the finish line. Maybe you just couldn't visualize a failure at the crimp point.
Yes, Larry you got it right. I gently took apart the Molex connector, but I could only test at spade lug - which is past the piercing point of the wire. I will do the hatpin test to definitively rule in/out a faulty connector.

Now I just gotta find me a hatpin. Maybe there's one in grandma's hat boxes LOL
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Old 04-28-2021, 06:31 PM   #53
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Almost there

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Yes, Larry you got it right. I gently took apart the Molex connector, but I could only test at spade lug - which is past the piercing point of the wire. I will do the hatpin test to definitively rule in/out a faulty connector.

Now I just gotta find me a hatpin. Maybe there's one in grandma's hat boxes LOL
The reason for the hatpin is that you can make contact at the right place and then reuse the wire or connector without having insulate a gap in the insulation. When you withdraw the hatpin, the hole creeps closed and it's like new.

You might be able to use a regular straight pin if you heated the wire a bit with your heat gun to soften the insulation a bit.
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Old 05-03-2021, 06:55 PM   #54
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please keep us posted
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Old 05-03-2021, 08:00 PM   #55
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Let us know if you were able to make it work.
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Old 05-04-2021, 05:12 AM   #56
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Hey Jim, Did you ever figure out what the problem was/is?
Inquiring minds want to know...........
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Old 05-04-2021, 09:09 AM   #57
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OK:

1. See if you have enough slack in the wires to remove the connector. If so, as a previous poster said cut the connectors off, put in a junction box and splice the wires using wire nuts. If you use a metal junction box be sure to ground it.

2. Ask the mice where they chewed through the wire LOL

3. If the run from the panel to the splice junction is bad, replace it. Try using the existing wire as the fish to pull the new wire through. If it wasn't stapled you might have luck. If not it will be a pain, but....
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Old 05-04-2021, 09:46 AM   #58
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Yes, Larry you got it right. I gently took apart the Molex connector, but I could only test at spade lug - which is past the piercing point of the wire. I will do the hatpin test to definitively rule in/out a faulty connector.

Now I just gotta find me a hatpin. Maybe there's one in grandma's hat boxes LOL
I have a problem solver called a power probe and I have found it to be the best tool for finding electrical problems works off your 12 volt battery and also can diagnose 120v systems. It has different connectors you can attach that makes diagnosing problems simple. One connector uses a pin probe that holds the wire and the pin pierces the wire when screwed tight. Also because of the external power supply you can send power backwards through the circuit if your checking trailer lighting and other things.

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Old 05-04-2021, 10:00 AM   #59
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The hat pit trick works great if you pierce the wire insulation and the wire in protected from the weather. But should you ever do it on a wire that is subject to weather make sure you seal the hole.

I spent a whole day tracing why the rear window of a station wagon wouldn't go down and found someone had pierced the insulation and not sealed it. The wire corroded due to water getting into the hole.
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Old 05-05-2021, 07:50 PM   #60
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The neutral came loose from the bus bar. Unless the OP verifies that he has accounted for and retorqued all of the neutral wires. The molex connector is most likely NOT the problem.
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