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Old 04-28-2023, 05:55 AM   #1
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Isolation, or ramping up immunity?

I think it’s safe to say that the SARS-CoV-2 virus is here to stay whatever the variant, and while it makes some sense to stay away from people, does that facilitate the immune system’s abilities?

While each one of us has some story to tell — almost all valid — our immune system works because of our exposure to disease (within certain bounds, of course). People have treated Covid as if it was Ebola, or were out in public wearing masks, gloves, face shields, even a biohazard suit (true story). My wife, who was admitted to a skilled nursing facility as a precaution and for testing following a very minor stroke, had a roommate added to her private room — a patient dying from the Covid virus — and my bride died from exposure to the virus as no isolation techniques were used in the facility in early 2020. No one knew.

Do I believe that we should walk around outdoors as if we were being exposed to radioactive fallout?

No.

Here’s a news flash: the sun’s UV radiation kills the virus. In seconds.

I contracted the virus in early 2022, living life as normal, and was sick for a few days. Here’s my point, though, and I hope you’ll think about this.

I worked for an international airline for decades… and was sick ONCE, in 1996. I went into a Doc-in-a-box acute care facility, was diagnosed as having the flu, stayed in bed a few days while having a fever, then went back to work. 26 years later, I got the ‘vid… was sick for two days, took the Ivermectin prescribed by an doctor (as I was overseas), and went back to work once the fever was gone.

While YMMV, we are incredibly efficient at fighting most diseases: true, if your health is threatened with an underlying medical problem, it makes good sense to protect yourself from contagion. Is the hysteria worth it, though?

Go outside. Get some sun. Wash your hands.

My girlfriend — an IT executive who works for an international company that creates medical billing systems IAW federal regulations for states — and I both were maskless these past three years (though I was nearly arrested in Seattle for not wearing a mask). We washed our hands frequently… but just with regular soap. Why were we so cavalier about our exposure?

My PCP — who once worked in a level 4 biohazard fcility — said that Covid was the flu with a couple of pieces missing. His patients, 2020-2023, were not required to wear masks; nor was his staff. Why?

He believed in the immune system’s capabilities — which, generally, gets stronger with exposure… within limits. I wouldn’t be cavalier about Ebola, but Covid isn’t THAT deadly.

We’ve known for a long time that most masks available cmmercially are as effective at preventing you from inhaling the virus as a chain-link fence is at keeping out blowing dust.

We’ve learned recently that there never was any scientific research behind social distancing. Want to see truly effective social distancing? Lend someone money, or your tools.

Ironically, we have two neighbors who are constantly ill. They’ve had all the shots and the boosters; they don’t even go out in public. Their food is delivered, and they dutifully wipe down or spray everything soming into their house. With just the two of them in their house, they wear masks and gloves… and don’t even go outside unless it’s absolutely necessary.

This is living?

This is just my opinion, of course. I’ve worked in one aspect or another of medicine for more decades than I care to reveal… and know that each of us are medically unique. Is that a reason to live a life of fear?

Not for me. YMMV.
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Old 04-28-2023, 06:48 AM   #2
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CPB - thoughtful, reasonable and well written . . .Thankyou.
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Old 04-28-2023, 07:40 AM   #3
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My story: family members and friends who were seemingly careless got Covid, some more than once. They survived, albeit in some cases with lasting undesirable consequences. Those that were always careful never got Covid, my wife and I included. It was obvious to me that protective measures were and are effective.

It sounds like you have adopted a lifestyle that works within your risk tolerance for illness. Unfortunately, it sounds like your neighbors are more fragile and must take extra precautions. Prevention measures are not one size fits all. I’d respect that they feel they need to do what they need to do.

I worked in hospitals all through my career. In that environment, I expect I would have had ample opportunity to improve my body’s immunity, yet I got sick often. Since Covid changed my lifestyle, and since I am also no longer forced to be closely around people, I simply don’t get sick anymore. It has been wonderful. I wear masks to this day, and no longer go to large gatherings or on airplanes, cruise ships, etc. I stay aware of the behavior of people around me and their proximity. It is the new normal for me, and it’s the way I want to live going forward - staying healthy and yet enjoying life.

As with anything in life, YMMV, so I don’t see any point in trying to preach one approach or another as being right or wrong. Thus, I now question the point in creating this thread or me responding to it.
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Old 04-28-2023, 08:44 AM   #4
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My story: family members and friends who were seemingly careless got Covid, some more than once. They survived, albeit in some cases with lasting undesirable consequences. Those that were always careful never got Covid, my wife and I included. It was obvious to me that protective measures were and are effective.

It sounds like you have adopted a lifestyle that works within your risk tolerance for illness. Unfortunately, it sounds like your neighbors are more fragile and must take extra precautions. Prevention measures are not one size fits all. I’d respect that they feel they need to do what they need to do.

I worked in hospitals all through my career. In that environment, I expect I would have had ample opportunity to improve my body’s immunity, yet I got sick often. Since Covid changed my lifestyle, and since I am also no longer forced to be closely around people, I simply don’t get sick anymore. It has been wonderful. I wear masks to this day, and no longer go to large gatherings or on airplanes, cruise ships, etc. I stay aware of the behavior of people around me and their proximity. It is the new normal for me, and it’s the way I want to live going forward - staying healthy and yet enjoying life.

As with anything in life, YMMV, so I don’t see any point in trying to preach one approach or another as being right or wrong. Thus, I now question the point in creating this thread or me responding to it.
There are many aspects to an individual’s immune system: exposure to contagion is one, but — that said — the other factors that effect the immune system can’t be ignored. Rest, diet, exercise… all influence the immune system — so if you’re frequently sick, is it because of a virus?

One other aspect that is important to an individual’s immunity: their psychological well-being. Someone who lives in fear is almost certain to run their immunity into the ground for a host of reasons… and the system must be considered in a holistic — or the overall “big picture” — sense. Any one aspect of the immune system being out-of-balance, the system eventually fails to protect the individual.

You use the word “preach” with regard to what I wrote: perhaps the better word is counsel, which is a portion of my expertise. I’m NOT a clinical psychologist: my expertise is in industrial psychology, more specifically, human factors. Therein, I am a consultant in risk management and mitigation: I have a number of clients for whom their overall systemic risk is evaluated (in other words, not in medical matters). We do, however, indirectly and tactfully encourage people to do their best to manage fear: I’ve counseled people for more than 30 years in this regard, because fear is responsible for more poor decisions made than alcohol, drugs, etc.

Fear is taking more lives than the virus. If you don’t recognize this for yourself, nothing else that I can communicate will convince you of this. Live well.
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Old 04-28-2023, 08:53 AM   #5
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As with anything in life, YMMV, so I don’t see any point in trying to preach one approach or another as being right or wrong. Thus, I now question the point in creating this thread or me responding to it.
This.
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Old 04-28-2023, 09:22 AM   #6
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The CDC states the number of deaths is declining, but even so, 1052 people die from covid every week in the USA as of this April. In total, 1,130,662 people in America have died and many epidemiologists believe that that number is about 30 percent too low because of mis-diagnoses. Many more people have had had their lungs permanently injured and now have breathing problems.

I may not be overly concerned about covid, but my neighbor, who I talk to everyday, could very easily loose his life if he becomes infected. IMO, We have a ethical obligation to try to practice good public health protocols such as some degree of social distancing and when mandated, wearing a mask. We aren't trained epidemiologists. They are the experts and IMO, it would be wise to follow their advice.
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Old 04-28-2023, 09:23 AM   #7
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——————
Fear is taking more lives than the virus. If you don’t recognize this for yourself, nothing else that I can communicate will convince you of this. Live well.
I never lived in fear of the virus. I learned about it, recognized the danger, then adapted my lifestyle to minimize my risk. Yes, I live differently now, changed my activities, changed my interactions with people, changed my public PPE, and because of that, I still do not fear the virus.

It is simple logic to recognize and identify the threat, then adapt to minimize the risk. The reason to be afraid would be if we had a threat for which we had no tools to fight, but we do have solutions for minimizing SARS-CoV-2’s threat.
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Old 04-28-2023, 09:36 AM   #8
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Chris said "isolation or ramping up immunity?"

I want to agree with this statement, but I am wondering if you can really "ramp up your immunity"? The virus reproduces rapidly and mutates. It is a moving target that constantly changes its makeup. This has been demonstrated by the fact that none of the original vaccines that once worked against it still works. The vaccines have to change with the virus.

I would certainly agree that keeping healthy and fit is probably the best way a person can protect themselves from disease.
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Old 04-28-2023, 09:43 AM   #9
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The sickest people: first-year school teachers. They catch everything.

The healthiest: veteran teachers. Their immune systems have seen everything.

That said (and being a teacher myself) I choose to mask in crowded public spaces because my wife has Stage 4 cancer and a damaged lung.

To each his own. There's no "right" answer for everyone.
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Old 04-28-2023, 10:05 AM   #10
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Are we still talking about this years later. Unbelievable. People died because they withheld treatment, sent elderly people back to nursing homes. Masks never did anything, 3 feet never did anything. It was all about control. If they cared about the sick they would have treated them, not let them die on ventilators.
More time and money was spent making sure people couldn't use ivermectin, and the other therapeutics.

Guess what years later, oh yeah, that's how we treat it now.

No need to respond no one will be convinced of anything other than what they currently believe.
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Old 04-28-2023, 11:07 AM   #11
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They are the experts and IMO, it would be wise to follow their advice.
How do we know they're the experts?

Seems like every evening newscast there were different people claiming expertise and had ever changing advice.

The height of the Covid crisis was also a time of opportunity for politicians to get "face time" on TV.

FWIW many people like to attend events where huge numbers of people are packed into close spaces. 50,000-100,000 individuals crammed into arena's, stadiums, entertainment venues, all sharing the exhaled air (and organisms) from the crowd. Football stadiums used to be open-air but today are covered, heated, "incubators. And then there are Cruise ships that already have shown to be a great place to get sick (Norovirus). As our society gets more crowded I fully expect we'll never see an airborn epidemics like "Covid" as the viruses will keep mutating and people's affinity for crowds continues.
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Old 04-28-2023, 11:08 AM   #12
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The TV told them what to do.. They didn't trust the science, they trusted the TV.
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Old 04-28-2023, 11:30 AM   #13
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The TV told them what to do.. They didn't trust the science, they trusted the TV.
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Old 04-28-2023, 11:49 AM   #14
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Washing your hands works against the flu, but not an airborn virus like Covid 19. We're still losing 200+ people a day to Covid19.

I KN95 mask up in indoor spaces and keep a distance in outdoor spaces.

Why should anyone care if I mask up or not against Covid19 or even if I wash my hands to prevent the flu. Peer pressure seems to be 'do not mask up', but I tend to resist peer pressure.

It's not fear, it's my way of dealing with risk of disease.

Of course, I'm also one of those people who check the air in my rvs tires every day when traveling, visually inspect them when I make a pit stop, and pay for roadside assistance.
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Old 04-28-2023, 12:07 PM   #15
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Do what you like, this is America.
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Old 04-28-2023, 02:18 PM   #16
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If you are not living, you are dying!

At the risk of oversimplifying, we are into year 3 of the "pandemic" and there is good data to support me thought. Each jurisdiction did slightly did not Public health measures, country by country, state by state, even city by city. In regards to lockdowns, closing churches, arrows on the floors of stores to direct traffic flow, plexiglass barriers, 6ft apart, face masks, etc, etc. Looking at the number of cases, hospitalization, ICU, and deaths due to Covid in all these place the results all trended on similar lines. Places like Sweden that did very little to disrupt their society have experienced similar deaths rates as places like California and New York. Even if you look at South Dakota compared to North Dakota, similar outcomes.

My take away none of those actions provided any benefit but led directly to destroying small businesses, families, friendships and relationships.

For what and why?

We are 3 years into this and they can't even tell us what Covid is or where it came from, yet people are still buying the BS.....for me I am so done with this nonsense.

"It is easier to fool the people than to convince them they have been fooled."
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Old 04-28-2023, 03:58 PM   #17
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At the risk of oversimplifying, we are into year 3 of the "pandemic" and there is good data to support me thought. Each jurisdiction did slightly did not Public health measures, country by country, state by state, even city by city. In regards to lockdowns, closing churches, arrows on the floors of stores to direct traffic flow, plexiglass barriers, 6ft apart, face masks, etc, etc. Looking at the number of cases, hospitalization, ICU, and deaths due to Covid in all these place the results all trended on similar lines. Places like Sweden that did very little to disrupt their society have experienced similar deaths rates as places like California and New York. Even if you look at South Dakota compared to North Dakota, similar outcomes.

My take away none of those actions provided any benefit but led directly to destroying small businesses, families, friendships and relationships.

For what and why?

We are 3 years into this and they can't even tell us what Covid is or where it came from, yet people are still buying the BS.....for me I am so done with this nonsense.

"It is easier to fool the people than to convince them they have been fooled."
I get that the precautions taken at first were easily justified as there was no significant data as to what the virus was and how it really worked. But as time went on and data became available it was often ignored or misinterpreted (on purpose or not) in a way that negatively impacted the lives of everyone not directly benefiting from the fight against covid.

At least now there is data from around the world as to how different precautions worked and we can make our own informed decisions as to how to live.

When it first started I took extra precautions with myself and my kids but nothing extreme. I have the one J&J shot only because I needed it to keep my job (before the fed mandate was dropped unfortunately). I had covid one time before the vax and one time about 1.5 years after the vax. Both had the same mild symptoms and the same "down time". Except the days I was contagious, I spent hours with moderate sized groups of people 7-8 times a month without masks, not using sanitizer all the time. It was outdoor activities and very few of us got really sick from being in that group. Others got really sick from other exposures, based on timing of symptom onset.
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Old 04-28-2023, 04:25 PM   #18
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K-6 Syndrome

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I worked in hospitals all through my career. In that environment, I expect I would have had ample opportunity to improve my body’s immunity, yet I got sick often.
This is also known as the well-accepted K-6 syndrome. If you don't know what that is, ask your neighborhood elementary school teacher.
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Old 04-28-2023, 06:42 PM   #19
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Personally, can’t wait for the “Twitter Files - Fauci Version” to come out.
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Old 04-28-2023, 06:58 PM   #20
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Well,........ on the news today at least in Virginia the Health Dept. is recommending another Covid vaccine booster shot be given to those 65 in older. As another new variant is out there. other groups later.......

Must go through the Health Dept. to get it. Oh Boy............. We will see how accurate the news report was.

Bottom line regardless, is to keep your guard up.

The DW is an RN and still takes precautions. Neither one of us has had Covid that we are aware of.

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