Sobering comparison between flu and Covid 19

[BigH]

Italy has lost more than 8500 people in last 2 weeks. 46 doctors...dead. An expert in Italy said it may be the middle of next month before the dying curve comes down.

What happens to the US dead per day numbers in the next week will give a us a good indication of what we have instore for us...I don't like our odds but the only way to improve the bed we made is to hunker down and shelter in place.

[Scrapper]

Just heard on the news that US has passed all other countries in the number of reported cases.


Quoted from CurtPutnam, "Young adults are dying from Covid19 too, albeit not as many as older adults."

Those young people had underlying conditions that were unknown to them, their family or family doctor. There's a report that an infant has died from Covid19.


Even if someone doesn't gets sic or show signs of illness it don't mean they are not carriers of the virus and infecting others.

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by CurtPutnam

If everyone stayed home for 2 weeks then everyone who has been infected would be sick and could be isolated and treated. The rest could resume life. However, there are always folks who figure they no better, or who simply do not care and become "Typhoid Marys". Those folks will run around and infect others during the incubation period.

Two weeks doubtfully would be enough to be absolutely certain.

I recall when schools would send kids home when they had a fever when checked by the school nurse and were not allowed to return until the fever was gone for a minimum of 24 hours.

Certainly wouldn't be that great if the virus was still active in a few and the whole deadly cycle began again. The only thing those who are fighting this virus know is what they've gathered in the last few months. In essence they're still making guesses based on limited information.

[waybeck2018]

Originally Posted by zj178

Yes, Italy was a prime tourist destination for hundreds - if not thousands, of Chinese tourists. It was a top travel destination for them and is now suffering the consequences of unchecked border entry.

Thanks to the quick action by President Trump in halting entry from China on January 31, there is a greater chance we will have a much greater chance to stop its spread.

[CurtPutnam]

Originally Posted by TitanMike

Two weeks doubtfully would be enough to be absolutely certain.

I recall when schools would send kids home when they had a fever when checked by the school nurse and were not allowed to return until the fever was gone for a minimum of 24 hours.

Certainly wouldn't be that great if the virus was still active in a few and the whole deadly cycle began again. The only thing those who are fighting this virus know is what they've gathered in the last few months. In essence they're still making guesses based on limited information.

Of course not. Not everyone can stay home. Police, fire, military and medical folks all have to stay on duty. Power plant operators, electrical workers, sewage plant, delivery and others are needed to do their jobs. The problem is that too many caveats not only dilute the message but make it so long people will not read it.

Were we to approach that ideal we could pretty much beat the virus and hold out until either a vaccine and/or a treatment is developed. But instead, we have folks deciding that there is no problem and they want to have their fun. For them, I hope karma is a bitch.

[TitanMike]

Originally Posted by CurtPutnam

Of course not. Not everyone can stay home. Police, fire, military and medical folks all have to stay on duty. Power plant operators, electrical workers, sewage plant, delivery and others are needed to do their jobs. The problem is that too many caveats not only dilute the message but make it so long people will not read it.

Were we to approach that ideal we could pretty much beat the virus and hold out until either a vaccine and/or a treatment is developed. But instead, we have folks deciding that there is no problem and they want to have their fun. For them, I hope karma is a bitch.

From what I've been watching and reading, many officials have had their fill of people like that and either have, or are planning to, enacted laws, ordinances, or regulations, that will hit those who ignore public health orders in the pocket book. Also, depending on locale, possible jail time.

Things like travel bans and curfews usually follow a course that starts with simple advice. Next in line, restrictions, If people don't get the message then police start with some heavy duty "Education", and as a last resort, arrests.

I guess it all depends on how hard one's noggin is as to when they finally get the message (and how much it costs them).

[travlinon]

I never thought that America would give up there freedoms for the government to just keep them safe. I see churches are closing on Sunday because they want to be safe, I wonder what Jesus world think of this mass hysteria. I don’t normally go to church, wife goes every Sunday. Tomorrow morning I’m going, I found a local church in a town that is having church tomorrow. It’s just amazing what’s happening because some people are afraid of doing something we all are going to to do eventually, die. I’m pretty sure a vaccine will be found but all will not take the vaccine, do you think the government will force people to take the vaccine. Or at least try. I had rather be dead than afraid. Anyway going back to to looking at other stuff on this forum

[BehindBars]

Originally Posted by travlinon

I never thought that America would give up there freedoms for the government to just keep them safe. I see churches are closing on Sunday because they want to be safe, I wonder what Jesus world think of this mass hysteria. I don’t normally go to church, wife goes every Sunday. Tomorrow morning I’m going, I found a local church in a town that is having church tomorrow. It’s just amazing what’s happening because some people are afraid of doing something we all are going to to do eventually, die. I’m pretty sure a vaccine will be found but all will not take the vaccine, do you think the government will force people to take the vaccine. Or at least try. I had rather be dead than afraid. Anyway going back to to looking at other stuff on this forum

I predict that having a “government can’t tell me what to do” attitude is an obstacle, a huge obstacle, that will cause the United States to have a more difficult time in the battle against the COVID-19 virus, and ultimately result in a much longer battle with more casualties than much of the world.

The United States, despite it’s technology and resources, may well be impacted worse than any other country in the world if we don’t use common sense and work together to defeat the virus' threat.

[mjones12]

Originally Posted by BandJCarm

This proves, at least to me, that you are seriously compromised, potentially, far more than I am, who isn't going anywhere.


Now you are going to go out and recreate. Why? Because you are not going to lose your freedom.


Then go. And if you have a car wreck along the way, don't expect an ambulance in many places. If one comes, don't expect a doctor at the hospital. If one comes, don't expect much help.


This site has a lot of rules. I struggle to keep from breaking many of them, often. But you are the problem here, and your dice-rolling view of life is dangerous to others.

Amen to that. You nailed it.

[wildcatter]

Originally Posted by waybeck2018

By all means, if you think you can do a better job then call the government and tell them you're available.

[B and B]

Originally Posted by travlinon

Going camping is probably the safest thing I can do now. I visit Walmart where there is a couple hundred people there. I visit my local grocery store. I go to Lowe’s and shop for flowers and plants. When I’m camping there is usually just me and wife, sometimes the granddaughter goes and her hamster. It’s just us but at home I’m around a lot of people, I’m not crawling in a hole. Life goes on and I’m enjoying my life, I enjoy seeing new places. I’m hoping that a drug will be found that will treat the effects of this virus. I don’t think the virus is going away any time soon. I think the faster the virus goes through the population the better off we will all be. Also if a vaccine is found how many people will refuse to take the vaccine. I don’t blame anyone that has health problems to stay out of the limelight as much as possible. I’m healthy plus I’m not overweight. I enjoy the outdoors. It’s seems a lot of people are afraid, news media has scared a lot of people. I served 2 combat tours in Vietnam and I didn’t see this many scared people. I just refuse to let fear rule my life and what IF, the biggest 2 letter word in the English language

What type of Doctor are you? Think military service trumps Science?

[BehindBars]

Originally Posted by travlinon

Going camping is probably the safest thing I can do now. I visit Walmart where there is a couple hundred people there. I visit my local grocery store. I go to Lowe’s and shop for flowers and plants. When I’m camping there is usually just me and wife, sometimes the granddaughter goes and her hamster. It’s just us but at home I’m around a lot of people, I’m not crawling in a hole. Life goes on and I’m enjoying my life, I enjoy seeing new places. I’m hoping that a drug will be found that will treat the effects of this virus. I don’t think the virus is going away any time soon. I think the faster the virus goes through the population the better off we will all be. Also if a vaccine is found how many people will refuse to take the vaccine. I don’t blame anyone that has health problems to stay out of the limelight as much as possible. I’m healthy plus I’m not overweight. I enjoy the outdoors. It’s seems a lot of people are afraid, news media has scared a lot of people. I served 2 combat tours in Vietnam and I didn’t see this many scared people. I just refuse to let fear rule my life and what IF, the biggest 2 letter word in the English language

So, you’re saying that if we quickly kill off all the people with a high risk of dying from being infected with the virus, the better off we will all be? You don’t think the better alternative is delay the spread of infection so that they might have a chance to live?

If I didn’t know better I would suspect yours is a trolling post, but unfortunately it may be for real.

[Beachbourbon]

Originally Posted by BehindBars

So, you’re saying that if we quickly kill off all the people with a high risk of dying from being infected with the virus, the better off we will all be? You don’t think the better alternative is delay the spread of infection so that they might have a chance to live?

If I didn’t know better I would suspect yours is a trolling post, but unfortunately it may be for real.

The way I understand it; once people have had it and recovered, they are essentially vaccinated so I think travlinon is alluding to this, not suggesting genocide IMHO

[BigH]

Originally Posted by travlinon

I never thought that America would give up there freedoms for the government to just keep them safe. I see churches are closing on Sunday because they want to be safe, I wonder what Jesus world think of this mass hysteria. I don’t normally go to church, wife goes every Sunday. Tomorrow morning I’m going, I found a local church in a town that is having church tomorrow. It’s just amazing what’s happening because some people are afraid of doing something we all are going to to do eventually, die. I’m pretty sure a vaccine will be found but all will not take the vaccine, do you think the government will force people to take the vaccine. Or at least try. I had rather be dead than afraid. Anyway going back to to looking at other stuff on this forum

I'm glad you can thump your chest and say you're not afraid but why in your mind do people have to be a afraid for themselves if they are following guidelines to limit the rate of infection? I'm afraid of transmitting this virus and leading to the deaths of many people. I'm afraid of being the cause that will stop my company from making drugs because I ignored shelter in place. I'm afraid of getting this and passing it to my wife/dad/daughter. I'm a vet, I've seen real fear in other peoples eyes. Rational fear is a good thing, it keeps people from doing stupid things. 46 doctors have died in Italy...I don't want to be part of the exposure problem. Italy is stacking bodies in arenas, we are already putting them in semis and when the real dying starts there will be fear. I enjoy life, living, camping, hunting, fishing, cooking, riding motorcycles, doing these things with my wife and family. I have fear of loosing these things, I fear being a cause that would take these things from other people. Shouldn't we all be afraid of taking these 'things' from others?

Why does a temporary inconvenience of giving up your freedoms make you afraid? How is your temporary loss of freedom more important than other peoples lives?

I don't understand how some folks are so narcissistically narrow minded. Can you fathom what would happen if we took no action? We would be digging graves in our backyards, there will be no hospital room at all. This has happened before...and we didn't learn from history as much as we should have.

I had doubts early on about the effects of doing nothing because there wasn't enough 'math' to make the case with this new Covid19...I don't doubt anymore. The US had 20,000 new cases yesterday and that number is actually about a week old...This Covid19 has the potential to destabilize the global economy because we didn't lock it down soon enough. There are already countries that have stopped all exportation, there will be more and this mess is just in the very beginning. Individuals are hoarding supplies, entire nations are starting to do the same thing. Italy has lost more than 8500 people in two weeks...we look to be on a pace that people will be praying for a number that small.

People are fleeing infected big cities and the real dying hasn't even started. You are going to see an approximation of what would have happened had we taken no action and you will only have to wait about two weeks because we lost control in New York. In a couple of weeks we will all be looking at New York and I hope we can say we should have done nothing and kept the economy going but it looks to me like we will see fear, the fear will be real (a entirely new concept of fear for some)...and hysteria will have real meaning.

You don't go to church but you are tomorrow...sounds like fear.
I hope no one infects anyone in church...and please pray that we come out of this ok. It won't be long until we see the results and then we will know.

[mjones12]

Originally Posted by BigH

I'm glad you can thump your chest and say you're not afraid but why in your mind do people have to be a afraid for themselves if they are following guidelines to limit the rate of infection? I'm afraid of transmitting this virus and leading to the deaths of many people. I'm afraid of being the cause that will stop my company from making drugs because I ignored shelter in place. I'm afraid of getting this and passing it to my wife/dad/daughter. I'm a vet, I've seen real fear in other peoples eyes. Rational fear is a good thing, it keeps people from doing stupid things. 46 doctors have died in Italy...I don't want to be part of the exposure problem. Italy is stacking bodies in arenas, we are already putting them in semis and when the real dying starts there will be fear. I enjoy life, living, camping, hunting, fishing, cooking, riding motorcycles, doing these things with my wife and family. I have fear of loosing these things, I fear being a cause that would take these things from other people. Shouldn't we all be afraid of taking these 'things' from others?

Why does a temporary inconvenience of giving up your freedoms make you afraid? How is your temporary loss of freedom more important than other peoples lives?

I don't understand how some folks are so narcissistically narrow minded. Can you fathom what would happen if we took no action? We would be digging graves in our backyards, there will be no hospital room at all. This has happened before...and we didn't learn from history as much as we should have.

I had doubts early on about the effects of doing nothing because there wasn't enough 'math' to make the case with this new Covid19...I don't doubt anymore. The US had 20,000 new cases yesterday and that number is actually about a week old...This Covid19 has the potential to destabilize the global economy because we didn't lock it down soon enough. There are already countries that have stopped all exportation, there will be more and this mess is just in the very beginning. Individuals are hoarding supplies, entire nations are starting to do the same thing. Italy has lost more than 8500 people in two weeks...we look to be on a pace that people will be praying for a number that small.

People are fleeing infected big cities and the real dying hasn't even started. You are going to see an approximation of what would have happened had we taken no action and you will only have to wait about two weeks because we lost control in New York. In a couple of weeks we will all be looking at New York and I hope we can say we should have done nothing and kept the economy going but it looks to me like we will see fear, the fear will be real (a entirely new concept of fear for some)...and hysteria will have real meaning.

You don't go to church but you are tomorrow...sounds like fear.
I hope no one infects anyone in church...and please pray that we come out of this ok. It won't be long until we see the results and then we will know.

Very well stated, but I doubt the guy you are addressing will be convinced.

[BandJCarm]

FWIW, I'm NOT self quarantining myself because some Government told me to. I'm doing it because I am using the FREEDOM allowed to me by God, and codified in our Constitution, to do what I think best.


The fact that the government is siding with me as to defining the right thing to do, is a wonderful coincidence.

[Dwilcox]

X2

[travlinon]

Lets see, I got up this morning and went to church along with 50 other people. Me and wife went to a seafood restaurant to eat, unfortunately we had to eat in the truck. Went to Tractor Supply to buy some horse treats so granddaughter can feed the horses next week, a neighbor has horses. Went to Walmart along with at least 200 people or more, had to buy weed killer and ant killer. Stopped by a local vendor selling fresh strawberries. Got home, then went to graveyard to kill fire ants. Home now. Still planning on a trip to Indiana April 17, unless the president shuts everything down. I like to eat at Rise n Roll. Probably all takeout now, anyway that’s worth the trip. Also the Blue Gate is probably takeout or maybe not by then. Hopefully all this will be over soon.

[CurtPutnam]

Originally Posted by travlinon

Lets see, I got up this morning and went to church along with 50 other people. Me and wife went to a seafood restaurant to eat, unfortunately we had to eat in the truck. Went to Tractor Supply to buy some horse treats so granddaughter can feed the horses next week, a neighbor has horses. Went to Walmart along with at least 200 people or more, had to buy weed killer and ant killer. Stopped by a local vendor selling fresh strawberries. Got home, then went to graveyard to kill fire ants. Home now. Still planning on a trip to Indiana April 17, unless the president shuts everything down. I like to eat at Rise n Roll. Probably all takeout now, anyway that’s worth the trip. Also the Blue Gate is probably takeout or maybe not by then. Hopefully all this will be over soon.

With thousands dying, you are boasting about wandering around. All I can say is WOW - just plain WOW.

[babock]

Originally Posted by CurtPutnam

With thousands dying, you are boasting about wandering around. All I can say is WIW - just plain WOW.

I have a friend who also is in NC that is in denial. He interestingly enough, is changing his mind though!