Winterizing Guide - Antifreeze

[aguyandhiscomputer]

I hang out in a couple FB Mini Lite groups and thought I'd join the FR forum and post a few items.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...it?usp=sharing

I'm always open to suggestions to improve it.

Adam

[5picker]

You've done a nice job with your documents.

Couple of notes on the winterizing procedure...

You mention removing the water filter canister after winterizing and using the contents of antifreeze to pour into the toilet and sinks. You didn't mention the shower P-trap and also... the contents of the water filter canister "may not' be enough antifreeze for ALL the P-traps. When you consider the bathroom sink, the kitchen sink, the shower, the toilet (outside sink if equipped) it likely will take more than just the contents of the water filter canister to protect the P-traps.

You also want some of that antifreeze to make its way into the holding tanks to protect the dump blade valves so you have to add a bit more to get the P-trap to overflow and allow antifreeze to make its way to the tank(s)

Also many folks have gone to putting an empty water bottle in the water filter canister so it doesn't take as much antifreeze to fill it. Just another option but one that would give you even less antifreeze to dump in the traps.

It is also very important to wipe the water filter canister threads and the housing of any water droplets when winterizing. There have been many reports here of a drop or two of water remaining on the threads and freezing and cracking the canister/housing.

One last thing... many folks (including myself) recommend to remove the screen from the city water inlet and depress the check valve to be sure antifreeze is protecting that area. Do not do this under full pressure or you will get soaked! Bleed a little pressure off the pump by opening a faucet before depressing the check valve and stand off to the side!

[aguyandhiscomputer]

That you for the info.

1. The traps should have enough antifreeze in them during the faucet process in the beginning. But I see what you mean.

2. I have seen the water bottle and even golf balls used to take up space in the water filter housing. I'll see how I can add a comment about that.

3. I used to press the city check valve but I found there isn't much water and, if any water is present after draining the low point drains in the first steps, the antifreeze will mix with any water in there and be fine. Unless you leave the lines pressurized all winter, there won't be any risk of water being pushed against the check valve.

[Iwritecode]

Originally Posted by 5picker

One last thing... many folks (including myself) recommend to remove the screen from the city water inlet and depress the check valve to be sure antifreeze is protecting that area. Do not do this under full pressure or you will get soaked! Bleed a little pressure off the pump by opening a faucet before depressing the check valve and stand off to the side!

I've seen this advice posted numerous times but I have to ask, what outlet are people using to blow air into their lines if they aren't using this one?

I've never needed to depress the check valve because that's where I connect my air compressor to blow out my lines.

So where does this step come in?

[5picker]

Originally Posted by Iwritecode

I've seen this advice posted numerous times but I have to ask, what outlet are people using to blow air into their lines if they aren't using this one?

I've never needed to depress the check valve because that's where I connect my air compressor to blow out my lines.

So where does this step come in?

When you DON'T use compressed air to blow out the lines first.

Not everyone blows out the lines first. Many people do not have access to an air compressor and simply drain as much water as possible from the low point drains.

[aguyandhiscomputer]

Originally Posted by Iwritecode

I've seen this advice posted numerous times but I have to ask, what outlet are people using to blow air into their lines if they aren't using this one?

I've never needed to depress the check valve because that's where I connect my air compressor to blow out my lines.

So where does this step come in?

It wouldn't apply to you since you're blowing through the city connection. It's all personal preference but I only recommend the antifreeze method since I help a lot of newbies.

The toilet flush valve is a common one to freeze and break since it's low in the trailer and the water line runs horizontally so water sits.

The air simply runs over the water in the lines. It doesn't push all of it out.

[aguyandhiscomputer]

Originally Posted by 5picker

Not everyone blows out the lines first. Many people do not have access to an air compressor and simply drain as much water as possible from the low point drains.

I find people overthink the blowing air first part. The antifreeze will push ALL of the water out so there's no need to use air.

The availability to an air compressor is another reason I recommend antifreeze.

If you see pink, you're done.

[Iwritecode]

Originally Posted by 5picker

When you DON'T use compressed air to blow out the lines first.

Not everyone blows out the lines first. Many people do not have access to an air compressor and simply drain as much water as possible from the low point drains.

Ah... I guess I forget there are people that do that.

Seems to me that most people either do only air or do both. People that do only AF and not air seem to be pretty rare.

[Iwritecode]

Originally Posted by aguyandhiscomputer

It wouldn't apply to you since you're blowing through the city connection. It's all personal preference but I only recommend the antifreeze method since I help a lot of newbies.

The toilet flush valve is a common one to freeze and break since it's low in the trailer and the water line runs horizontally so water sits.

The air simply runs over the water in the lines. It doesn't push all of it out.

I do both. Less worry about the AF getting diluted by the water left in the lines.

[5picker]

Originally Posted by aguyandhiscomputer

I find people overthink the blowing air first part. The antifreeze will push ALL of the water out so there's no need to use air.

The availability to an air compressor is another reason I recommend antifreeze.

If you see pink, you're done.

Originally Posted by Iwritecode

I do both. Less worry about the AF getting diluted by the water left in the lines.

I do both as well.

On larger motorcoaches or R/Vs where the kitchen may be in the back or have an island, long runs of plumbing can have a tendency to 'mix' the antifreeze with the water in the line before it gets to the faucet.

Preaching "stop when you see pink" doesn't always hold true in those cases.

If you blow out first... you pretty much guarantee when the "pink begins to flow" it is not diluted.

I suppose stating "leave the antifreeze run for 10-15 seconds AFTER you see pink" might do the trick (and possibly add enough antifreeze to the P-trap to cover that as well) but for whatever reason it seems everyone always says "stop when you see pink"

[aguyandhiscomputer]

Originally Posted by 5picker

I do both as well.

On larger motorcoaches or R/Vs where the kitchen may be in the back or have an island, long runs of plumbing can have a tendency to 'mix' the antifreeze with the water in the line before it gets to the faucet.

Preaching "stop when you see pink" doesn't always hold true in those cases.

If you blow out first... you pretty much guarantee when the "pink begins to flow" it is not diluted.

I suppose stating "leave the antifreeze run for 10-15 seconds AFTER you see pink" might do the trick (and possibly add enough antifreeze to the P-trap to cover that as well) but for whatever reason it seems everyone always says "stop when you see pink"

Stop when you see pink means you don't see clear water. Not sure what else there is to worry about after that. Water and antifreeze doesn't mix inside 1/2" lines. It all gets pushed out. If you said the water filter housing, then I would agree.

[Iwritecode]

I knew I had posted a poll at one time. Didn't realize it was 5 years ago...

I guess the number of people that use AF without blowing out the lines first is higher than I thought.

64 people said they do both, but 54 people said they do AF only.

https://www.forestriverforums.com/fo...l-95062-2.html

[5picker]

Originally Posted by aguyandhiscomputer

Stop when you see pink means you don't see clear water. Not sure what else there is to worry about after that. Water and antifreeze doesn't mix inside 1/2" lines. It all gets pushed out. If you said the water filter housing, then I would agree.

We'll disagree on this one. I've actually captured some of the first 'pink' out of a line and it wasn't all antifreeze. (diluted) And... there have been many folks post here that didn't dump the water filter first or even worse, don't remove the filter cartridge before pulling antifreeze into the system so those folks may get 'pink or clear' that is pretty much useless.

It's hard to write up a procedure that covers all the bases for everyone. That's why so many manufacturers use generic wording and verbiage that basically covers their *****.

[aguyandhiscomputer]

Originally Posted by Iwritecode

I knew I had posted a poll at one time. Didn't realize it was 5 years ago...

I guess the number of people that use AF without blowing out the lines first is higher than I thought.

64 people said they do both, but 54 people said they do AF only.

https://www.forestriverforums.com/fo...l-95062-2.html

It's really not that shocking. You'd have to really screw it up to have enough water mixed with antifreeze in order for it to cause a problem.

[aguyandhiscomputer]

Originally Posted by 5picker

We'll disagree on this one. I've actually captured some of the first 'pink' out of a line and it wasn't all antifreeze. (diluted) And... there have been many folks post here that didn't dump the water filter first or even worse, don't remove the filter cartridge before pulling antifreeze into the system so those folks may get 'pink or clear' that is pretty much useless.

It's hard to write up a procedure that covers all the bases for everyone. That's why so many manufacturers use generic wording and verbiage that basically covers their *****.

I feel it's just a trailer and the PEX and fittings can handle some diluted antifreeze. If it was a boat engine, then I would really be a stickler.

Agreed. Everyone has their preference. I'm all about "doing whatever helps you sleep at night."

[Harkerr]

I use air and make two passes. Then anti freeze in traps. Important to remember to press toilet flush valve to blow it out

[2WheelJon]

I have this posted in the Rockwood forum. It's a work in progress. Comments welcome.