Upgrade to class A

[Who Dat]

Possibly going to a Class A 37' or 38' gas from a 32' class C gas. My Class C tows my four door Jeep Wrangler no problem but I'm concerned that a larger Class A with the V 10 engine maybe under powered. Anyone with a Class A V10 with a tow vehicle please let me know how it works for you.


Thanks,
Who Dat

[kenandterry]

I’ll start.......The V-10 will pull your Jeep without breaking a sweat.
I’ve never been the fastest up the side of the mountain, but I’ve never been the slowest.

BTW....we just downsized from 10 years with a 35’ Georgetown pulling my Terrain.

[Dodge Guy]

Not sure how you do in the mountains or on slight grades now, but be prepared for possibly being a little slower. Gas mileage will definitely be less because of the lack of aerodynamics an A will give you.

I’m getting a 5 star tune next year for mine. It should make a difference. It made a big difference on my 02 V-10 Excuraion and 35ft TT!

[DougW]

We tow our car on a trailer behind us so the weight back there is very close to the 5,000lb max rating. It does pretty good on the interstates, if there are steep or long grades it will be in 4th gear and turning 4,000 rpm but you probably already do that anyway. As someone else said, you are not going to be the first one to the top of the hill but you will get there OK. On secondary roads in hilly country it shifts a lot, but that is to be expected with the V10. Ours has the 6 speed and I wish I could lock out 6th gear for rolling country but the only choice on the shifter is to lock it in 4th and that is just too low for normal driving. Using Tow/Haul seems to mostly affect the downshifting when braking with very little difference in the shifting on the hills.

[rk06382]

Originally Posted by Who Dat

Possibly going to a Class A 37' or 38' gas from a 32' class C gas. My Class C tows my four door Jeep Wrangler no problem but I'm concerned that a larger Class A with the V 10 engine maybe under powered. Anyone with a Class A V10 with a tow vehicle please let me know how it works for you.


Thanks,
Who Dat

The Class A 3-valve V10 engine has 320 hp. The Class C V10 has 305 hp.

I have towed our Taurus on a dolly & I could not tell any difference.

[NXR]

A lot will depend on the GVWR and GCWR ratings on whatever you choose. Some Ford F53 chassis’s have a 4,000 pound difference and some have a 6,000 pound difference. Both come with a 5,000 pound hitch.

If you choose the 22,000 lb chassis or the 26,000 pound chassis you’ll have the 4,000 pound difference. If you have a heavy four-door Jeep like a Rubicon you will need to weigh at least 1,000 pounds below GVWR when fully loaded up for a trip.

If you choose the 24,000 pound chassis, like the GT7 has, you’ll have a 6,000 pound difference. I would then replace the 5,000 pound hitch with a 7,500 pound hitch and just know I can pull 6,000 but probably not 7,500 pounds unless my fully-loaded weight was 1,500 pounds below GVWR.

I think the 6-speed transmission was introduced in 2015 or 2016. If you’re buying used and it’s near those years, run the VIN to see which transmission it has.

As someone noted, people with the 5-speed think the 5Star tune helps a lot. Many people with the 6-speed transmission, like me, think it’s OK as stock.

Make sense?

Ray

[dahagen]

I went from a 28 "C" to a 32 foot "A" and never have I been happier. Same engine as the "C" but less problems with wind, better visibility, are a LOT more inside room. About the same gas mileage (6.75). I tow the same small car and can not even tell it is there on the "A". Yes I do slow down on 7% grades, but I still am faster than most trucks.

[Duckogram]

I have a C on an E450 V10 305 hp and I tow up the hills and down the hills. I have the 6 speed trans. and I am using a 5-Star custom tune. 9 mpg Average.
I had an A on an 18k F-53 V-10 345 hp and I towed the same toad up and down the same hills. It had the 5 speed trans. and I used the 5-Star standard MH tune.
7 mpg Average.
The 5-Star made a huge difference with the A. Mostly the shifting manners but not so much on the power.
On the 6 speed it did not improve shifting as dramatically but it did increase the power of the 305 noticeably.
Rumor is that the new F-53’s will get a V-8 7.5L tug boat engine. If it was me, I’d wait a year or two before I bought into that.
Also notable is that the largest of the A gassers, according to my friends that drive them, are sluggish when it comes to performance. But these are not performance vehicles.

[LannyCox]

We have a 2013 Winnebago Adventurer 37F with the V-10 engine and our dinghy is a 2014 Honda CRV with AWD. We have had no problems driving this combination although we have not traveled in the mountains yet. I normally drive with the “Tow/Haul” system and Cruise Control engaged. The Cruise Control has a tendency to “downshift” when going up a hill which creates a lot of noise in the “cockpit”. So, to avoid that noise, I usually disengage the Cruise and maintain speed with the accelerator in high gear.

[ActionJackson]

Originally Posted by dahagen

I went from a 28 "C" to a 32 foot "A" and never have I been happier. Same engine as the "C" but less problems with wind, better visibility, are a LOT more inside room. About the same gas mileage (6.75). I tow the same small car and can not even tell it is there on the "A". Yes I do slow down on 7% grades, but I still am faster than most trucks.

I am curious about the “ less problems with wind” comment? How does the RV front A/C compare to the class C A/C. One thing that keeps me from going A is losing the automotive-style cab and the two front doors.

[BehindBars]

Many, if not most, class A models do not have driver and passenger cab doors. I'd considered going to an A and losing the cab doors to be a downgrade from a C. I also wonder about crash safety on an A, where the RV builder made the cab, vs a C where the chassis builder made the cab.

Let's just call going to an A from a C a lateral move, not an upgrade or downgrade.

[ActionJackson]

Originally Posted by BehindBars

Many, if not most, class A models do not have driver and passenger cab doors. I'd considered going to an A and losing the cab doors to be a downgrade from a C. I also wonder about crash safety on an A, where the RV builder made the cab, vs a C where the chassis builder made the cab.

Let's just call going to an A from a C a lateral move, not an upgrade or downgrade.

Guess it is everyone’s different opinion. A class has a “bigger interior “ feel, but no Real sleeping/ storage area above cab. My DW will drive our C , but not an A. That 28-32 area is a toss up depending on personal preference. So far, we are C. Easier tire replacement, easier Ford ( or Chevy) replacement parts for cab/ motor/ drivetrain problems .

[Dodge Guy]

Originally Posted by Duckogram

I have a C on an E450 V10 305 hp and I tow up the hills and down the hills. I have the 6 speed trans. and I am using a 5-Star custom tune. 9 mpg Average.
I had an A on an 18k F-53 V-10 345 hp and I towed the same toad up and down the same hills. It had the 5 speed trans. and I used the 5-Star standard MH tune.
7 mpg Average.
The 5-Star made a huge difference with the A. Mostly the shifting manners but not so much on the power.
On the 6 speed it did not improve shifting as dramatically but it did increase the power of the 305 noticeably.
Rumor is that the new F-53’s will get a V-8 7.5L tug boat engine. If it was me, I’d wait a year or two before I bought into that.
Also notable is that the largest of the A gassers, according to my friends that drive them, are sluggish when it comes to performance. But these are not performance vehicles.

The 7.3 in the 2020 class A's is not a rumor. They are already on the roads.

My 2012 F53 is rated at 362HP and 457TQ. Just to offer a little info.

[LannyCox]

Originally Posted by ActionJackson

Guess it is everyone’s different opinion. A class has a “bigger interior “ feel, but no Real sleeping/ storage area above cab. My DW will drive our C , but not an A. That 28-32 area is a toss up depending on personal preference. So far, we are C. Easier tire replacement, easier Ford ( or Chevy) replacement parts for cab/ motor/ drivetrain problems .

Quite a few Class A motorhomes had a bed above the cockpit seats. With an electric switch, it lowers down to just above the top of the cockpit seats. Depends on the make/model.

[LannyCox]

Originally Posted by BehindBars

Many, if not most, class A models do not have driver and passenger cab doors. I'd considered going to an A and losing the cab doors to be a downgrade from a C. I also wonder about crash safety on an A, where the RV builder made the cab, vs a C where the chassis builder made the cab.

Let's just call going to an A from a C a lateral move, not an upgrade or downgrade.

My Winnebago Class A has a door next to the drivers seat; but, at my age (80) it is a difficult climb up to get it. However, in an emergency, I could certainly use it to exit the coach.

[FlaNative]

Before we decided to buy our first rv we rented at least 3 times before deciding to buy. We settled on the 5th wheel concept and was happy with it. We traded our first 5th for another 5th wheel; Our friends all have Class A's and love them. We then traded our 2nd 5th wheel for a Class A built by Holiday Rambler. That was the worst mistake we have made in rving. We had so much trouble with it (interior walls separating, slides that failed at the campground, right front wheel bearing going bad after 5k miles, and the list goes on.) The one thing that I had an issue with was the lack of power from the V10. (This was a '15 Vacationer). Down here in Florida, just going onto an overpass made the V10 downshift, and we're at 4500 rpm's with the cruise control on. I later learned to feather it going up the overpass and it helped with the downshifting/rpm level. Additionally the engine noise factor was such that we had to shout to one another while enroute. (We settled that issue by re-securing the Dogbox with additional clamps: it brought the db level down enough that we could stop using sign language! In the mountains this rv struggled to make it up while towing our Terrain.
Having said all that, our Class A was most likely one that was a lemon. There have been so many on the road, that if all were built like that, the manufacturers would have gone broke long before now. Our friends still have their Class A's and are very happy with them.

After that fiasco, we went back to the 5th wheel and couldn't be happier. Our '05 GMC diesel tows our '17 Cardinal very well: no more 4500 rpm's and constant downshifting; engine noise is at low levels again and we can carry on a conversation with better fuel mileage.
We believe that Class A's would be better served by a front end diesel. Today's engine technology have quieted the diesel down to more appealing levels (especially Ford) and the fuel mileage would be a real plus, along with the torque to get it up the hill. With all the manufacturers installing engine exhaust brakes in today's trucks, the downhill venture would be more relaxing. I realize that this means upping the cost of the unit (including a diesel generator) but it would be more appealing to the rv public, and not approach the $200K level that introductory rear engine diesels start out with.

By the way, our '05 GMC Duramax came with 305 h.p. and 650 ft lbs of torque, stock. I don't think the gassers are offering anything comparable in power.

[Duckogram]

Jimmy James, To make a long story short, what you experienced was not a lack of power. It was the shifting pressure strategy that Henry built into your 5 Speed.
Back in ‘15 there was (and is) a simple plug and play fix available. Armed with new pressure settings, your HR would not have downshifted when it saw an overpass and your Triton V-10, which is a high revving screamer of an engine, would have been running at maybe 3000 RPM and you could have heard your DW talking about all the shopping to be done when you get there.

[LannyCox]

Duckogram said "Back in ‘15 there was (and is) a simple plug and play fix available."


I curious as to what this ". . . plug and play . . ." is and what it does.

[Duckogram]

Originally Posted by LannyCox

”...I curious as to what this ". . . plug and play . . ." is and what it does.

It is what I described in post #8. The 5Star tune on the SCT platform is a hand held device that you plug into the OBDII socket and it reprograms your ECM with optimum settings.

[NXR]

Originally Posted by Duckogram

It is what I described in post #8. The 5Star tune on the SCT platform is a hand held device that you plug into the OBDII socket and it reprograms your ECM with optimum settings.

Thanks for the clarification. I understood your initial comment to infer that there was a Ford fix.

I've read a few times that Ford did come out with a new program that corrected many of the issues with shift points on the 5-speed but I've never seen the actual details. People would just write that they complained and Ford reprogrammed and shifting was much better afterwards

Ray