Horrible first experience

[nadjap]

We purchased a 30 WR for our business use. We need to haul about 4,000 lbs. of cargo (heavy stage, above ground pool, miscellaneous equipment) as well as have a place to sleep. We towed the WR that we purchased in January with very little equipment (maybe 1,500 lbs.) about 2,000 miles r/t in a Toyota Sequoia twice with little to no issues earlier this year.
Because we knew we were going to put a lot of miles and wear and tear on the tow vehicle, we purchased a 2013 Ram 2500 and thought we were good as gold! When we filled the trailer a couple of weeks ago the sway issues were SCARY! Luckily we live about 45 minutes from a Camping World. They were convinced it was the hitch. After purchasing a new hitch ($900) that did NOT solve the problem, the manager suggested that it was a weight distribution issue. So we moved things into the bedroom and kitchen and into the bed of the truck and it is riding relatively smooth for 2,000 miles.
BUT, here is my question. Isn't the cargo area designed to hold the weight? Distributing the cargo to the entire trailer defeats the purpose of having a designated cargo area, which was the big sell of this trailer. Any ideas? Could something be wrong with the trailer itself?
Any suggestions would be appreciated!

[Lynkage]

I think that is a bit much for a 2500 and bumper pull trailer. Maybe you could add airbags or overload springs and sway control to the rear axle of the truck.

Good luck.

[nadjap]

Thanks for your response Shane & Antoinette! The 2500 is rated to tow 17,400 lbs. and we did add the hitch with dual cam sway control (Reese). I'm not opposed to adding airbags, but on paper it appears that what we have should work. Do you have experience with that making a big difference?

[AquaMan]

The trailer states that it has a cargo capacity of around 4900 lbs. That is including ALL items normally in a TT. The cargo capacity for the rear is probably less than half that stated capacity. If you are putting close to 4K in the rear cargo area, you are going to have problems, that won't go away. Distributing that much weight, I think, is your only solution.

[dustman_stx]

I'm not exactly sure what trailer you have. But I will say that, even though my knowledge about toy haulers is limited, the entire available payload CANNOT be placed in the rear of the camper. This is obviously a travel trailer if you pulled it with a Sequoia. Think about it- you have to be able to tow this toy hauler loaded or not, right? Therefore, you would have to have sufficient tongue weight when unloaded to still have at least several hundred pounds of tongue weight when loaded. The amount of tongue weight you'd need to be able to offset 4K being loaded behind the axles would be way more than what you could feasibly have and tow the trailer unloaded. Tongue weight will have to be at least 10% of the weight of the trailer to not have a sway problem. Most people will say 12-13% is optimal. You need to weigh the trailer loaded, and then get your tongue weight when loaded. This will be very revealing as to why you are having a problem.

[ependydad]

I'd take a step back and hit some scales and do some weighing. Anything you do at this point is guessing until you get some knowledge and can make an educated decision.

You need to find either a CAT Scale or local scale (quarry, dump, farmer, etc.) that you can get some weights. Specifically, you need to find out:

a) What does your truck and camper weigh with the weight distributing system hooked up (i.e. spring bars attached)
b) What does your truck and camper weigh without the weight distributing system hooked up (throw the bars into the back of your truck)
c) What does the truck alone weigh

In each case, you want to get individual axle weights - the "steer" axle on the truck (the front one); the "drive" axle on the truck (the rear tires) and then the camper's axle (obviously not in #3 because you've left the camper parked in a parking spot).

The CAT Scales are typically around $10 for the first weighing and then $1-2 for each re-weigh within 24-hours.

From these numbers, we can calculate your tongue weight and total weight for the camper.

You want to make sure the truck and camper are loaded up like you normally camp. Make sure everyone stays in their seats, etc. If you're going to an actual CAT scale - keep in mind that they're setup for big rigs and reaching the call button can be a challenge. There are 2 great suggestions for this: a) carry a 3' broom handle to push it or b) go inside before you weigh and get a phone number for the scale desk + call them from your cell from the scales.

Your goal is achieving 10-15% tongue weight for the total camper weight. As well, you want to make sure the hitch is dialed in and is pushing sufficient weight back to the front axles (dealerships generally fail you here- even though it looks like they know what they're doing).

And finally, a major deviation from above - what type of tires are on your Ram (size, type, brand/model)?

[Lynkage]

Without knowing the specifics of your truck it is hard to tell but GCWR does not tell the whole story. If anything it will depend on the payload capacity

Also hanging 4k of the back end of your trailer behind the axles will most certainly create a problem no matter what. You always load the heavies on top of your axles.

Have you looked up your truck and its specs to see just what you can tow?

[dustman_stx]

I am about 99% sure his problem is not with HOW MUCH weight but rather WHERE that weight is. Take ependydad's advice about getting those weights.

[ependydad]

Once you do weigh, it'll be helpful for you to post your truck's stickers showing available payload and GVWR (gross vehicle weight rating).

See these as examples of what we're looking for:
Weight Sticker 1
Weight Sticker 2

[nadjap]

Thanks so much, will do this ASAP!

[Lynkage]

Originally Posted by dustman_stx

I am about 99% sure his problem is not with HOW MUCH weight but rather WHERE that weight is. Take ependydad's advice about getting those weights.

True!
It would also seem that he is overweight or close to it with a bumper pull with a gvw of 13k and a 7k truck. I doubt that his receiver is rated for 13k. That is a heavy BP and with the weight behind the axles that would be plain disastrous.

[nadjap]

I wish the sales people where we bought this Work 'n Play (Camping World, Spartanburg) were as knowledgeable and honest as all of you! We were very candid with our needs...

[fonzie]

Cargo Carrying Capacity 4,982 lbs. (2,260 kg)

This rating is not only for the cargo area, it is for the full trailer (water, clothes, groceries, beer etc etc), so for the cargo area itself it would be less than that number. As other said, you need to get some weights and go from there.

[ependydad]

Originally Posted by nadjap

I wish the sales people where we bought this Work 'n Play (Camping World, Spartanburg) were as knowledgeable and honest as all of you! We were very candid with our needs...

I'll give 2 answers to this.

1) I think we all overestimate the knowledge of sales people at dealerships in general. After all, they're in the business and this is what they're Jon is. Why wouldn't they know what they're doing? The truth is- I'd love to see a survey of how many are campers/RVers themselves. I know my experiences, even with specific models was that I went in armed with more info than most of the folks I've dealt with (but I'm a geekly book learner).

2) I think there are exceptions, but they're trying to make a sale. Looking at the gross numbers, they want to get you sold and get that commission check. On the forum, we aren't selling you.

[Oaklevel]

Need to weigh your set up but it sounds like you are weigh (LOL) overloaded..... Most garage areas are rated at 2000 - 2500 lbs.... Cargo of 4900 includes propane, options of the trailer, gear, water in all tanks,+ Our TH dry weight started at 9200 but with options came in at 9650 so 450 of our capacity was just trailer options...........

By putting all the weight in the back will make the front end of the trailer light & sway will be dangerous..........60% of the weight of any trailer should be in front of the axles....

Toyhaulers are not built to be cargo haulers it just plain will not work............. good luck but your scale weight should tell the story.............

[bakken]

Because you had no issues when hauling a lighter load, and also by putting part of the heavier load to the front, I think you have answered your own concerns. You simply cannot put 4000 lbs at the back of the trailer, which causes the hitch to be very light. That is a well-known cause of big problems on the highway.

[nadjap]

Originally Posted by ependydad

I'll give 2 answers to this.

1) I think we all overestimate the knowledge of sales people at dealerships in general.

2) I think there are exceptions, but they're trying to make a sale. Looking at the gross numbers, they want to get you sold and get that commission check. On the forum, we aren't selling you.

Unfortunately I am afraid you are right. But I depend on a plumber, electrician, architect and lawyer to all do their jobs and know their industry. Why do we settle for less from sales people? Sorry to rant, I am grossly off-topic...

We originally purchased the WnP because it had the largest cargo capacity of any TT toy hauler we looked at. Does anyone know of an option for what we are looking to haul in a TT?

Thanks again!
Nadja

[bakken]

Originally Posted by nadjap

Does anyone know of an option for what we are looking to haul in a TT?

Thanks again!
Nadja

Not for the weight you are looking to carry, unless you want to go to a huge fifth wheel.

[dustman_stx]

Originally Posted by bakken

Not for the weight you are looking to carry, unless you want to go to a huge fifth wheel.

I'm not sure he's gonna find a fifth wheel that he can place 4K in the rear of. But they may be out there. Can't imagine what the unloaded pin weight would be on it.

[Lynkage]

There are custom Work and Play trailers out there (typically by equestrian makers) that are made to exactly what you want.

A goosneck horse trailer to start, then made into what you need.
Just a suggestion.

A place here in Denver called Five R does them.