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Old 10-20-2020, 03:07 PM   #1
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I Think I Need a New Truck!

Finally got around to getting my rig weighed at CAT Scales and the results aren't what I was expecting. Towing my 23WS with a 2015 Ram 1500 Quad Cab 4x4 with a 5.7L Hemi and 8-speed transmission.
Here are the results:

J1=TV front axle (hitched): 3300 lbs (FGAWR = 3900 lbs)
J2=TV rear axle (hitched): 4060 lbs (RGAWR = 3900 lbs)
J3=Trailer axle (hitched): 5460 lbs
M=TV fully loaded (unhitched): 6700 lbs (GVWR = 6900 lbs)

So, my tongue weight would be J1+J2-M = 660 lbs.
Gross trailer weight would be J1+J2+J3-M = 6120 lbs. (GVWR = 6510 lbs)
That makes my tongue weight 10.78% of my trailer weight. I can live with that. A little higher would be better, though.

Here are my issues:

1. TV rear axle weight is over max by 160 lbs. I may be able to move some things around to help this but it won't be easy and even if I get there, I will always be near my limit. I wonder if adjusting my WDH can divert some of that weight to the front axle. It was put on by the dealer and I didn't have all that much in the bed at the time if I remember correctly.

2. My trailer axle weight was 5460. The sticker on the trailer says FGAWR=3000 lbs. but the trailer has two axles. The RGAWR was left blank. Do I spread this weight evenly over both axles? If so, then I'm ok.

3. Fully loaded and unhitched, I'm 200 lbs under my GVWR. If I add the 660 lb tongue weight, I'm well over. Even if not, I'm awfully close but I'm not sure how this works. I am assuming the tongue weight would be added since it is additional weight the TV is carrying.


Your thoughts and comments would be much appreciated!
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Old 10-20-2020, 04:50 PM   #2
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Each axle is rated at 3000 pounds.

Did you weigh the trailer tongue or compute it? How can 660 pounds of tongue weight overload the rear axle on the truck? What's the cargo capacity of the truck, not less than 660 I assume.

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Old 10-20-2020, 05:08 PM   #3
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M=TV fully loaded (unhitched): 6700 lbs (GVWR = 6900 lbs)

This gives you 200 lbs of available payload without the trailer. What all do you carry in the truck?
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Old 10-20-2020, 05:41 PM   #4
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If you want to determine whether the hitch is adjusted properly, you need another set of weights - you want to weigh the axles of the truck with the trailer unhitched.

We know that the whole truck weighs 6700 empty (that seems high, but I'm not a Dodge guy, so...) And we know that your front axle is 3300 with the trailer on, but we don't know what it was without the trailer - so we don't know what the hitch is doing.

If you want to see if you are in the ballpark, you can get an idea by measuring the distance from the ground to the center of the fender arch above the front tire, before and after hooking up. The measurement should be very close to the same - it can be up to 1/2" higher with the trailer, but in no case should it be lower.

Like others have said, I would be interested to know what you are carrying that gets you to within 200lbs of payload before the trailer is connected? What is the payload, according to your tire loading sticker?
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Old 10-20-2020, 06:49 PM   #5
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You should be able to transfer more weight off the rear axle by adjusting the ball tilt.
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Old 10-20-2020, 07:19 PM   #6
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What's the truck's cargo capacity? It's on the data plate.

My Ford Expedition SUV has a cargo capacity of 1416 pounds leaving plenty of capacity for the trailer on the ball. But I don't carry around a load of bricks in the back.

-- Chuck
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Old 10-20-2020, 08:23 PM   #7
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I Think I Need a New Truck!

When you have actual weights the cargo capacity on the sticker is irrelevant. Put four 250lb men in your SUV and a couple of hundred lbs of gear in the back and you are at 200 lbs of remaining payload capacity. It is not hard to do.
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Old 10-20-2020, 09:00 PM   #8
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Your actual GVWR is 7,360 lbs (3,300 + 4,060).

So yes, you’re overweight on rear GAWR by a little and GVWR by a lot.
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Old 10-20-2020, 09:20 PM   #9
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Your actual GVWR is 7,360 lbs (3,300 + 4,060).

So yes, you’re overweight on rear GAWR by a little and GVWR by a lot.
That is not his Gross Vehicle Weight Rating. That is his fully loaded weight on each axle with the trailer connected. He's 600lbs under his front axle max, and 160lbs over on the rear.

As he mentions in his value labeled M, his truck's GVRW is 6900lbs - so he's 460lbs over that rating, too.

Each axle is rated at 3,900lbs max, but you can't just add the max axle ratings together because they are not necessarily the limiting factor. Maximums will always be limited by the weakest component.
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Old 10-20-2020, 10:11 PM   #10
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That is not his Gross Vehicle Weight Rating. That is his fully loaded weight on each axle with the trailer connected. He's 600lbs under his front axle max, and 160lbs over on the rear.

As he mentions in his value labeled M, his truck's GVRW is 6900lbs - so he's 460lbs over that rating, too.

Each axle is rated at 3,900lbs max, but you can't just add the max axle ratings together because they are not necessarily the limiting factor. Maximums will always be limited by the weakest component.
His actual Gross Vehicle Weight is indeed 7,360 lbs. Yes, you absolutely add the actual weights of the front and rear axle together.

Front (3,300) + rear (4,060) = actual weight of 7,360 lbs which is over the vehicle’s rated limit of 6,900 lbs (by 460 lbs)
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Old 10-20-2020, 10:23 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IvoryHemi View Post
Your actual GVWR is 7,360 lbs (3,300 + 4,060).

So yes, you’re overweight on rear GAWR by a little and GVWR by a lot.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IvoryHemi View Post
His actual Gross Vehicle Weight is indeed 7,360 lbs. Yes, you absolutely add the actual weights of the front and rear axle together.

Front (3,300) + rear (4,060) = actual weight of 7,360 lbs which is over the vehicle’s rated limit of 6,900 lbs (by 460 lbs)

You said that his Gross Vehicle Weight RATING was 7360. That is incorrect. The GVWR is a specification provided by the manufacturer.

His Gross Vehicle Weight is indeed 7360, but that was never the question, and it wasn't what you said.

It may have been what you meant, but there is no way for anyone else to know that.
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Old 10-21-2020, 08:32 AM   #12
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So, not that it matters but for those wondering what I have in the truck that adds weight, besides myself and my DW (we'll say about 350-ish right there), I also carry a fully loaded cooler in the back seat along with snacks and a few odds and ends that don't amount to more than 20 lbs or so. In the bed, I carry 3 large totes of firewood, another tote that holds tiki torches and a propane lantern, a milk crate that holds tiki fuel and charcoal lighter, a 16 lb bag of charcoal, a 2-burner propane camp stove, a 12x12 screen tent, an aluminum step ladder and an aluminum tubular extending ladder, a battery powered leaf blower with extra battery and a few miscellaneous tools. I also have an Extang tri-fold bed topper that adds probably 50 lbs or so.

Some of these items could go in the camper if they had to but I prefer them in the truck bed due to the nature of what they are or how they are used. Don't want the firewood in the camper because I don't want bugs in there. Would prefer not to keep flammables or spillables in there, either. The ladders and leaf blower are used outside and are just easier to access if they stay in the truck as well.
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Old 10-21-2020, 12:11 PM   #13
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No question. You need a bigger truck. The little Dodge ain't up to the loads.

-- Chuck
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Old 10-21-2020, 12:28 PM   #14
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Need a truck

I was in the same fix you were in. I could tow 10,500 with my 2019 Ram 1500. Sad thing was I had no payload left to add things into the truck. Just traded to a ram 2500 and don't have to worry any more. Hope you solve it !!!
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Old 10-21-2020, 12:45 PM   #15
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I was in the same fix you were in. I could tow 10,500 with my 2019 Ram 1500. Sad thing was I had no payload left to add things into the truck. Just traded to a ram 2500 and don't have to worry any more. Hope you solve it !!!
Yeah, I'm looking at 2500's now but WOW! they are expensive!!
Mine's almost paid off so I should get a decent trade-in to offset the cost a bit but still, I didn't expect they would be so much!
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Old 10-21-2020, 12:47 PM   #16
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No question. You need a bigger truck. The little Dodge ain't up to the loads.

-- Chuck
Yeah, I was afraid of that.
Been wanting to take the camper out to Colorado but I can tell even by the hills around here that I wouldn't want to take on that challenge with my current rig.
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Old 10-21-2020, 01:44 PM   #17
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I tow an R-Pod 195 that weighs in at 4200 loaded with a 2017 RAM 1500 5.7L 4x4 longbed, and am right at my payload/GVWR limits so I'm not surprised that a trailer that weighs 2000# more than mine puts you over. That 660# tongue weight is the killer.

FWIW I have no issues on the bigger passes/climbs here in Colorado (just climbed Vail Pass and Floyd Hill at 65) so I bet your current setup could handle things out here, but given the weight issues I bet you'll first come out this way in your brand-spankin' new 2500.
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Old 10-21-2020, 01:47 PM   #18
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You shouldn’t need a 2500 for that unit unless you’re planning on upgrading to a much bigger trailer. There are lots of 1500/150 trucks that can handle that, and a lot more.
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Old 10-21-2020, 02:15 PM   #19
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I’m in the same boat. I have a 2019 Ram 1500 towing a 7800lbs TT. I had a 2012 Ram 2500 previously with the 5.7 hemi and thought the new 1500 would be ok with the same engine and advertised towing capacity. I was wrong. The trailer sways a lot more with the 1500 even with towing gear. (I only used towing gear on the 2500 for highway travel because it didn’t really need it). The 2500 had a 30 gal gas tank and the 1500 has a 24 gal so i have to stop 4 gas more on long trips. The bigger alternator on the 2500 kept my batteries charged better. Power wise they are the same I’ve towed with the both in the Adirondacks, Berkshire’s Blue Ridge and Smokey’s and the both pulled the same on 9% grades (about 4000 to 4500 rpms and transmission temp around 205). Those mountains highways, while having more ups and downs l, are at the most 2200ft above sea level while out west they start at 6000ft and go much higher so you are going to need a diesel to tow comfortably out there. Personally I’ve ordered the 3 motor Cybertruck which should get here in 2022 when I was planning on trading my 1500 anyway.
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Old 10-21-2020, 02:44 PM   #20
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Yeah, I was afraid of that.
Been wanting to take the camper out to Colorado but I can tell even by the hills around here that I wouldn't want to take on that challenge with my current rig.
I concur. I know it’s not my money and certainly appreciate how expensive they are. But, from just a safety standpoint Alone,(including insurance liability should you be in a wreck and discovered to be overweight) biting the bullet is worth it. Not to mention braking power, high altitudes (diesel is king) and a longer wheelbase will all go a very long way to your towing pleasure and safety. Plus when you upgrade your rig you’ll have the truck to pull it. Look at 350/3500 series instead to see what nominally additional cost would be for another 1000 lbs or so of CCC. Best to you!
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