Solar panels. How many needed?

[Paulie1138]

Mud Yapster, looks like you have a great setup!

[Kenny kustom]

He has a very " minimalist" approach.

I've never been that... " thrifty".

But he makes a few good points, while beating others to death.


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

I am nice!

[mud yapster]

Originally Posted by Paulie1138

Mud Yapster, looks like you have a great setup!

Thanks Paulie it has served us well, we use the system just as if we were plugged into a power pole except for running the A/C units of course. The sun is coming up, the coffee is made and the news is on the 42" TV, the solar system is already up to 14 amps and climbing. Hope your system setup works as well as ours does.
Happy Boondocking
Mud

[Paulie1138]

M.Y., mine is a portable system thus far, as I am still gathering all the pieces/parts. I have taken it on a week long boondocking with 2 panels, and have observed a high of 33 amps!-using smaller wire than I plan to use for the permanent install. The way these panels put out, I may only install 2, and might keep the other 2 as add-in portables, or make another system for somebody. These kept us in heating, lights, TV, refrigerator, and all the rest! Temporary battery pack is 6 12v 100 AH AGM batts. wired in parallel (they are freebies) plus the standard coach battery on an AB switch. Batteries never went below 75-80% of 1/2 rating! I have a 3kw Samlex pure sine inverter. Knowing my limited battery bank, I do not run heavy loads! I also use stuff as if connected. (Except AC, of course!) In fact, I was charging some of the others in our group's batteries after mine reached full charge, usually around noon. I am hoping to get my #6ga wiring from my basement to my panel location during the holidays. have not quite figured out my mounting so far, but I have ideas. Hopefully, I get my unit back from the dealer, as the sides are out of adjustment yet once again!

[Paulie1138]

Kenny, yea, he has beaten a few up, but he avoids really slinging them too far in the dirt. I know some of whom he speaks, have seen their "work" at top dollar, and have to agree with him. For what these people paid, even compared to what I am getting together, they are getting junk at a far higher price than I am doing. However, I will add....that I am acquiring my stuff a piece at a time, getting decent deals on the stuff, and am doing all the work myself. I have to add....for what they paid, they SHOULD be getting better than what they have. The installers insist on using 10ga wiring from the panels to the controller, and #8 from the controller to the batteries. While that might almost work ok.....(not) I am getting a lot more just by by using larger wiring. During the install phase, the wiring size upgrade is CHEAP and most definitely worth the price of admission. I am installing #6 from the panels to converter, and 1/0 to the batteries. every 10th of a volt to the batteries makes a big difference on how well they get charged! This equates to battery longevity. I had a smaller 150w (2x 75watt) setup on my pop top trailer and a PWM controller, but used large wiring practices. I typically got 7-9 years from my batteries. Even when I replaced them, they worked well enough to run my solar night-lights I have around the house for several years beyond that!

[Kenny kustom]

The controller I am looking at, allows up to 2ga from the panels to it.

So that's what mine will get. The biggest that will fit the controller.

Also 2ga from controller to batteries.

4/0 from inverter to batts.


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

I am nice!

[Paulie1138]

Originally Posted by Kenny kustom

The controller I am looking at, allows up to 2ga from the panels to it.

So that's what mine will get. The biggest that will fit the controller.

Also 2ga from controller to batteries.

4/0 from inverter to batts.


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

I am nice!

Hi Kenny! What controller are you going with? Just curious! After I read your post about wire size, got me to thinking that 1/0 was a bit small.....re-read my post, and went out to look at the wiring included with my inverter. Mine is also 4/0! I bought my Samlex 3k used, but pristine condition from CL, traded an old 600 watt Honda Genset for it that I bought 30+ yrs ago before solar on my tent trailer. A testament to Honda. That has sat in my back garage for over 20 yrs! Drained the gas, put in new, started up on the second pull!

Also, one of the guys I camp with, has a 475 watt solar, uses 46voc panels, so gets more amps at 12 v, a 1kw Honda, and 6 battery setup. He runs his AC as needed during the day, and is able to break even in the charging department. However, he took the AC from his roof, and converted his AC system to an ultra efficient split residential type unit. During peak solar, he does not even run his generator. He does Hvac for a living, so...... I camp mostly in the mountains or desert camp in the cooler months, so rarely need the AC.

[Kenny kustom]

I will be doing the outback flex max 60/80. Running the panels in series for high voltage/low current.
I know, with having high voltage, I could run smaller wire.. But why.
It accepts 2ga.
Magnum hybrid inverter.


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

I am nice!

[Kenny kustom]

I'm not a fan of heights..
Something about having 300lbs come crashing down....

So I will climb up a total of twice.
Once to measure out available solar real estate. Once more to install them. I will not be tilting the panels, so might toss an extra one up, to make up for not tilting.

I know though, especially being up north, tilting would make a big difference.



2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

I am nice!

[Paulie1138]

I am still debating my permanent install....to tilt....or not to tilt! I am thinking, if fixed, leave 2 to be portable and tie them in as needed. Thinking, 2 of each each in series. When the portables are added in, they would be in parallel with the first 2. That would keep my Voc below the ratings of my Morningstar.

[Blackhat6mike]

Originally Posted by Kenny kustom

I will be doing the outback flex max 60/80. Running the panels in series for high voltage/low current.
I know, with having high voltage, I could run smaller wire.. But why.
It accepts 2ga.
Magnum hybrid inverter.


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

I am nice!

I also use the FlexMax 60. Great MPPT rated to 750 watts. With 8 x 100 watt panels, you never see them maxed out. Wish the control head wasn't so expensive AND smaller.
I have an Aims 5,000 watt/10,000 surge inverter connected with 0/4 cables to about 550 amp hrs of bats and a Parallax auto trans switch. We rarely use the inverter, but it's there when and if. Been caught at two CGs before when the power went out. Never again.

[Kenny kustom]

Originally Posted by Blackhat6mike

I also use the FlexMax 60. Great MPPT rated to 750 watts. With 8 x 100 watt panels, you never see them maxed out. Wish the control head wasn't so expensive AND smaller.

I have an Aims 5,000 watt/10,000 surge inverter connected with 0/4 cables to about 550 amp hrs of bats and a Parallax auto trans switch. We rarely use the inverter, but it's there when and if. Been caught at two CGs before when the power went out. Never again.

I would like to pick your brain before I go all in.


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

I am nice!

[Blackhat6mike]

I got started with solar, saw how well it worked and just couldn't stop adding. Had to stop with batteries as weight/space is a problem. In order to carry that many bats, I had to do without other stuff and move things around for balanced weight. I'm still 1,000 lbs + under max, but fighting a tire problem.
IMHO, a MSW inverter works just fine for all we do and cost about half as much as a PSW unit. There are other opinions, but this is my personal experience.
As a CET, I can assure you that ideally, higher voltage moves a lot easier with less amperage. Amperage takes larger wire as the voltage decreases. They are adversely proportional in the same size wiring. One goes up, the other goes down.

[Kenny kustom]

Originally Posted by Blackhat6mike

As a CET, I can assure you that ideally, higher voltage moves a lot easier with less amperage. Amperage takes larger wire as the voltage decreases. They are adversely proportional in the same size wiring. One goes up, the other goes down.

I know..
That's why I'm going to run in series, very high voltage, but under
15A.
Let the controller convert the really high voltage/low current.



2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

I am nice!

[Blackhat6mike]

Originally Posted by Kenny kustom

I know..
That's why I'm going to run in series, very high voltage, but under
15A.
Let the controller convert the really high voltage/low current.



2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

I am nice!

That's what the controller does for a living. It samples the battery voltage and charges accordingly. Pretty smart machine if you ask me. Use fuses! Plenty of fuses. Fuses between everything. Between panels and controller, controller and bat bank, bats and inverter, inverter and transfer switch, bats and house. Everywhere!

[Kenny kustom]

I enjoy wiring.

My TJ I built, had a stand alone fuse box for everything I added, including the stand alone fuel management system for the crate engine.

All with led fuses as well.
Circuit breakers etc.

The OCD shines through!


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

I am nice!

[Kenny kustom]

Originally Posted by Blackhat6mike

We rarely use the inverter, but it's there when and if. Been caught at two CGs before when the power went out. Never again.

You run everything 12volt?

( or did you mean generator)


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

I am nice!

[Paulie1138]

BH Mike, thanks for chiming in. Good way to put the volt/amp comment. MSW's will work fine for almost everything. Just get a small PSW if you encounter troubles with certain electronics and save the money. I got a great deal on my PSW. For my permanent install, I am looking into using a battery pack from a hybrid. Still doing early research. Like the idea of going lithium for ease of charging and weight saving. For now, am going to use the 6x 100amp AGMs that I repurposed. 4x Kyocera 192 watt 46 Voc panels that did not work, gotten free from a local solar installer before they went to the landfill! I repaired those. So far, have just the cost of the controller and connectors in my system. Looking to use a Trimetric monitor, not gotten yet. Currently using a good ammeter with a volt meter to monitor. So far, my permanent system is a work in progress.

I had solar on my old Pop Up trailer with 2 group 27's. 180 watts. Did everything and more than I could of hoped for! Did a lot of boondocking with that. Used broken house panels, with I repaired into a 12v system. Flat mounted on the roof. Used a basic PWM type controller. Built that setup in '89, and it served me all those years.

[Kenny kustom]

Originally Posted by Blackhat6mike

I also use the FlexMax 60. Great MPPT rated to 750 watts. With 8 x 100 watt panels, you never see them maxed out. Wish the control head wasn't so expensive AND smaller.

I have an Aims 5,000 watt/10,000 surge inverter connected with 0/4 cables to about 550 amp hrs of bats and a Parallax auto trans switch. We rarely use the inverter, but it's there when and if. Been caught at two CGs before when the power went out. Never again.

What panels are you using?
What's your input voltage to the controller?
I read somewhere, but now can't find it, there was an ideal voltage where it was the most efficient.


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

I am nice!

[Bluepill]

You guys are giving me panel envy.


I currently have my A Frame at the dealership to replace leaky skylights. It seems to be a common problem. If it happens again, I may pull them out, cover the holes, and then I would have the perfect excuse to mount a few panels.