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Old 11-15-2018, 04:11 PM   #1
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Towing heavy 5th wheel with SRW

Hello all,
I'm considering upgrading our fifth wheel to something similar to a Cedar Creek 37RTH.


Pin weight is of most concern, but a dually isn't particularly of interest to me on several levels, so I was hoping to get some feedback from friends here who are happily towing similarly heavy fifth wheels with SRW (single rear wheel) trucks, and if so, what would be useful advise in doing so.


Thanks in advance
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Old 11-15-2018, 04:29 PM   #2
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You want to tow a triple-axle 5er toy hauler that has an 18,000LB GVWR and ~3,200LB pin weight with a 3/4-ton SRW?

You'll be way over GCWR and more than likely way over GVWR and RAWR for that truck.

Simple answer: No.

If you had a 3500 (1-ton) SRW then MAYBE but still likely no. 2500? Absolutely not.
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Old 11-15-2018, 05:02 PM   #3
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I loved this set-up and it was awesome. I did have air bags.

Bought my F450 just because I liked the look of the new ones. But we put several thousand miles on that 2015 F350 SRW with the Vengeance.

Rear axle weight was right at the 7000 lb. which is what the truck is rated for. Gross total weight? Yep, I was over.
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Old 11-15-2018, 05:15 PM   #4
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Well the 2018 Ford towing guide does not even show 4.10 gears for a 6.2 L gas. So if I take the 2/3 of the difference between the 4.30 gears 3.73 gears you could figure about 13,900 pounds of 5th wheel towing capacity.
By the way you would definitely want to change and upgrade your hitch, with your 16K hitch you would be WAY over the hitch limits if you did upgrade.
No SWR truck is going to be rated high enough to safely tow a 18,000 pound 5th wheel. You will have to go to a dual wheel truck if you are going to carry that type of weight safely. Engineers put max number on truck and tow equipment for good reasons.
Could you pull around the block with no problem Yes, but if you put this massive overload on the road you are just asking for problems.
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Old 11-15-2018, 05:25 PM   #5
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I hate to be blunt, but NO WAY sorry. The 1st time you have to hit the brakes hard or descent even a 5% grade when it's wet .....

Go to a reputable website like B&W and plug in your numbers. I guess you are already over at least your GCVWR.
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Old 11-16-2018, 10:09 AM   #6
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Thanks all for the replies.


KFX450RXC - interesting setup, and somewhat what I was envisioning. Thanks for the input.


clr - thanks for the note on the hitch. I was thinking the same.



DieselDrax - no where did I mention using a 3/4 ton truck for this - certainly not my current TV.




I like the 3 axle setup idea on the trailer for stability and the extra 2 braking wheels.
Keep the useful comments, and sharing of your setups coming. Good feedback.
Thanks.
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Old 11-16-2018, 10:33 AM   #7
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Thanks all for the replies.


KFX450RXC - interesting setup, and somewhat what I was envisioning. Thanks for the input.


clr - thanks for the note on the hitch. I was thinking the same.



DieselDrax - no where did I mention using a 3/4 ton truck for this - certainly not my current TV.




I like the 3 axle setup idea on the trailer for stability and the extra 2 braking wheels.
Keep the useful comments, and sharing of your setups coming. Good feedback.
Thanks.
You also didn't say you were going to look at bigger trucks, and your signature has a chevy 2500 in it, I took it as you were asking about that truck/camper combo. With that being said I have a 2014 RAM 3500 CCLB CTD, my towing capacity is 17.5K with a 4306 CCC, I would not tow a 5th/camper that size, I know the new trucks have higher capacities, I myself would not go over the documented capacities of the truck being used.
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Old 11-16-2018, 10:43 AM   #8
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No way and your signature says 2500 diesel. so what do you have? Later RJD
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Old 11-16-2018, 10:50 AM   #9
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DieselDrax - no where did I mention using a 3/4 ton truck for this - certainly not my current TV.


As mentioned, you also didnít say you were going to replace it. You only said you werenít interested in a dually, which IMO is what that trailer really calls for if you want a good towing experience.

There are some 1-ton SRW trucks that may work on paper if youíre careful, but honestly why spend money on a marginal truck that you have to worry about how everything is loaded? If youíre going to get a different truck then get the proper truck for the job. I know a dually is a pain for a daily driver but I would rather deal with a dually as a daily than a marginal truck towing a huge trailer. One is an inconvenience, the other has safety implications.
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Old 11-16-2018, 03:01 PM   #10
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When I had a customer that was looking at units that were obviously too much for their TV, I told them that they should at least have as many wheels on their TV as the unit they were looking at. Then they would often reply “so you’re telling me that you won’t sell me a unit”.
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Old 11-16-2018, 04:19 PM   #11
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Hey

Well, I just got my new Cedar Creek 34IT. The unloaded weight is 12120 lbs. GVWR is 16200 lbs. My truck is a Ram 3500 CC SB HO CTD. The truck is good for 11700 GVWR. And with the b&W hitch in, Iím max around 3150 lbs remaining payload. That includes full tank of fuel me and DW and Hardhat cover.

So Iím thinking this will weight 14000-14500 lbs loaded because I know the weight of the stuff I pulled out of my old unit. I can haul this up to the 16200 lb GVWR but if I do I will be below the axle and tire ratings but I will be over the GVWR on my truck by a couple of hundred pounds.

I will switch to Ricksonís, and 19.5 tires if I have to with a set of air bags on the rear. That gives you carrying capicity near duelie territory.

Keep in touch.
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Old 11-16-2018, 04:30 PM   #12
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There are some dealers out there now that will look to see what you have for a tv if not enough for the for the camper you are looking at they will not sell you the camper. Later RJD
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Old 11-16-2018, 04:55 PM   #13
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I have over 20K miles towing a triple axle toy hauler with a RAM SRW truck and have never felt out of control even when I lost my trailer brakes in the mountains of CO. I had to go over Vale pass and through the Eisenhower tunnel
using tow haul and the engine brake, I never got over 55 mph on those grades. I also had to make a PANIC stop in St Louis when an idiot driver cut me off to cut into the traffic lane to our right that was almost stopped. I have the heavy duty Firestone air bags and my trunk runs level. My father in-law has worked on diesel Fords and Dodges for 30 years and says the frame, engine, transmission are the same and I don't have a rough ride when I'm empty.
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Old 11-16-2018, 05:03 PM   #14
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I have over 20K miles towing a triple axle toy hauler with a RAM SRW truck and have never felt out of control even when I lost my trailer brakes in the mountains of CO. I had to go over Vale pass and through the Eisenhower tunnel
using tow haul and the engine brake, I never got over 55 mph on those grades. I also had to make a PANIC stop in St Louis when an idiot driver cut me off to cut into the traffic lane to our right that was almost stopped. I have the heavy duty Firestone air bags and my trunk runs level. My father in-law has worked on diesel Fords and Dodges for 30 years and says the frame, engine, transmission are the same and I don't have a rough ride when I'm empty.
OP. You will get many negatives about this set-up. Its the nature of the beast here on RV forums. But as I've said before, we logged a few thousand miles with our F350 SRW and it was always comfortable. Like CoMadMax stated, I never felt out of control. You gotta go with what feels comfortable to you. But go to any crowded campground and looked at how many 1 ton SRWs are sitting on the same spot as the triple axle they tow. Its really not that uncommon.
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Old 11-16-2018, 05:11 PM   #15
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Although the 5er gvwr is 15,200 I'm 1000 - 1350 under that depending if I was able to top off the FW tank. So ~~ 14,200 with a F350 4x4 SRW and will NEVER go DRW again. That PIA was 1 and done. However I would never consider pulling 18K and probably not 16.5K either.
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Old 11-16-2018, 05:13 PM   #16
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But go to any crowded campground and looked at how many 1 ton SRWs are sitting on the same spot as the triple axle they tow.

It's really not that uncommon.
Not uncommon...but very, very scary!

I guess the part that gets me is the "I don't care" attitude of those who are obviously way over their tow ratings, yet do it anyway.

I used to tow on the edge...barely within the tow ratings.

Until I had that one moment in time that I thought was the end...coming down Hwy 34 out of Estes Park, Colorado.

Matter of fact...here it is about 20 minutes before that happened:

That was the last time that truck towed my previous trailer.
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Old 11-17-2018, 08:14 AM   #17
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ID:	191618this guy is in the site next to ours. He is pulling his 37rth with a 250. There is no way I would attempt it. I was pulling my fifth wheel with a 250 srw and I was slightly over weight. I now use a 350 drw. I noticed that his posted dry weight, which means nothing, is more than my max weight. I canít imagine how far over he is. Seems pretty scary to me.
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Old 11-17-2018, 08:41 AM   #18
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Attachment 191618this guy is in the site next to ours. He is pulling his 37rth with a 250. /....../ I canít imagine how far over he is. Seems pretty scary to me.
If it scares you that much, then it's a good thing you don't try it. I think if 'weight police' like yourself minded your own business more, you wouldn't be so scared....
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Old 11-17-2018, 08:55 AM   #19
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If it scares you that much, then it's a good thing you don't try it. I think if 'weight police' like yourself minded your own business more, you wouldn't be so scared....


Sounds like I hurt someoneís feelings. Must also be over weight.
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Old 11-17-2018, 09:06 AM   #20
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Sounds like I hurt someoneís feelings. Must also be over weight.
I'm sure I am, in your eyes
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