Added tankless hot water heater Girard 1GWHM

[Major Malfunction]

I did a lot of research on this topic before making the switch and there just isn't many threads out there regarding this topic. Now that I've gone through with it, I figured I'd pay it forward for anyone that is interested.

The reviews I have found mostly were along the lines of "I hate it!". But in the end, it seemed that these people didn't understand how they worked, so their actions actually worked against their uneducated attempts to make the situation better. Being that I have a tankless hot water heater in my house for a few years, I figured I would be OK with my purchase since I understood these people's "mistakes". If your whole life you just turn on the hot water and then mix cold into it to get to the desired temperature, than a tankless can seem a lot weird in how it operates.

I had a standard propane/electric 6 gallon heater in my TT. I have a 2015 Coachman Apex 300BHS. If you wanted consecutive showers, well, we all know how well that goes. And not to be a diva, but if I'm traveling the country and enjoying myself for years to come with my TT, I'm not content with taking Navy showers and waiting 20 minutes between them for the next person. I want unlimited hot water and so does the rest of my family if we shower in the TT :P

I ordered a Girard 1GWHM and then the shroud and door separate. Total cost was about $550 through Amazon. Doing the research, I wanted the ability to manually control how hot the water could be and the Girard offers a manual dial over how the Atwood worked.

To mount it, it fits in the same size as the existing water heater. Simply cut and remove it. If you have a working knowledge of how to plumb with Pex, you can replumb what you need in minutes.

In my bathroom is the on/off switch for the heater and also the red reset light. This doesn't use a reset light, so I used the existing wiring to mount the manual heat dial here. This allows me to control how high the BTUs get on the tankless system depending on the outside temperature and/or incoming water temperature. As we know, sometimes it can be 100 out but that well water is still a chilly 54 degrees.

Hooked it all up and worked as expected. The main thing is that you basically don't even use the cold water faucet when taking a shower. If you open the hot water all the way, the temp is warm. If you CLOSE it some, the water gets a lot hotter with little reduction in flow. The idea is that if you reduce the flow, the water spends more time in the manifold and thus picks up more heat.

This is where people screw this up. They dial this back and it gets too hot, then they turn up the cold water. What happens is that the intake into your TT is diverted to the cold side and you now have even less water to the heater. The result is the water gets HOTTER. Eventually, the water hits the high temp cut off and you get really COLD. Then it turns back on....repeat. This is the infamous hot,cold,hot,cold cycles you will read about if you do any research. In the end, it just takes some getting use to and not really having to use the cold water at all or very little.

It's pretty quiet although you can hear it "spool" up as it fires. Overall, I'm pretty pleased with it. I let it run for 15 minutes and I had no fluctuation or changes in the hot water I could detect. I also ran it for 10 minutes off my water tank and water pump without issue. Worked just as well.

I will say that if you are into dry camping, this isn't for you. You will go through more water than normal because you need a minimum GPM flow or it wont fire. I believe its around a 1.25 GPM. So if you are trying to conserve water, forget about it. I usually only hook up to full service campgrounds, so this is no worry for me. Also, I have 2 propane cylinders onboard, so its not a big deal about fuel, either.

Overall, I'm pleased with how easy it went to do it myself and I can't wait to take it out for the seasons. Obviously, it could break down on my next month and I'm signing a different tune! But so far I haven't run into anything that scares me or makes me think I won't get good use out of it.

Hope this helps anyone that might be looking into this.

[MrNiceGuy]

Thank you for taking the time to post both your review and excellent explanation of the operation. I have been looking at the tankless water heaters and find your post very helpful.

Jim

[Rbertalotto]

Great review and advice. Thanks

[hardoiler]

Good review,Thks for the information.

[muddyrode]

We also have a tankless and it did take some getting use too
but now that we know how to use it we are happy with it

[Dwilcox]

Very nice install and use info. Let us know how it works when you camp out with it.

[jgourlie]

Great review, thanks for taking the time to do it

[DRM796]

We have a tank less and we love ours. One of the key factor is the water pressure. We have found the higher the pressure the more room you have for adjusting the water temp. Just my thoughts.

[Major Malfunction]

Originally Posted by DRM796

We have a tank less and we love ours. One of the key factor is the water pressure. We have found the higher the pressure the more room you have for adjusting the water temp. Just my thoughts.

Without a doubt. In some cases, the pressure is great but the shower and kitchen sink have water flow reducers on them. I don't on mine, but most RV faucets do. So you end up not being able to flow enough GPM even though the water pressure is fantastic. Usually you take apart the nozzle and remove the restrictor washer.

[conceptumator]

We had some issues at first with defective parts, probably due to the dealer not securing their lot, which resulted in folks stealing the water heater doors and thus leaving the unit exposed to the elements. The Girard folks were extremely helpful, carefully explaining how it worked, just as you have. They had to school the dealer on the repairs, too, or they would never have gotten it fixed. Once it worked, it's been great ever since. Very good explanation - thanks!

[AandJWV]

Thanks for the help. Our ordered CC has tankless, and hopefully you bent the learning curve for us a little. Thanks again!

[Falcon72]

Thank you so much for your review. I really want to change out our 6 gallon tank for exactly the same reasons you state.

[MainelyUS]

What a timely post...thanks. if you have pic of the installation and/or "the on/off switch for the heater and also the red reset light. This doesn't use a reset light, so I used the existing wiring to mount the manual heat dial here" could you post them.
Thanks for inputs...enjoy the HOT H2O

Happy Trails

[ChateauV10]

I am looking at other posts on tankless WH and was concentrating on the Surburban tankless, but my shop is pushing the Girard. Two things I am not clear on are the improvements in the 2nd generation version selling now regarding setting and maintaining a given temp and the actual amount of water flowing.
We often camp at electric only sites and while I don't really mind refilling the fresh and carting the grey, wasting water is never a good thing.
I just read the owners manual for the latest model of the Girard and they say min flow is 0.9 gal/min. I can live with that, I think. But-how does this really effect water usage? Am I going to force the use of full-blast showers at 1.5 gal/minute (regulated by the shower head) and so go through 12 gallons of water in an 8 minute shower?


I am also wondering-how long does it take to get hot water out of the heater? I know delivery will be dependent on length of pipe to the shower (for example) but how long before hot water shows up at the outlet of the heater? (I am asking because Suburban does quite the dog and pony show talking about exactly this thing)
Can I turn the shower on and off at the shower head with out freezing or boiling when I turn the water on again after 20 or 30 seconds?
Additional comments from current users would be welcome!

[conceptumator]

Here's what I can tell you from my experience with the Gen II. Once they got it all fixed, it works great for me but it us different from a tank model. In my shower, it takes about 20 seconds or so at full flow to get hot water coming in. I adjust the temperature switch based on outside temps, i.e. 40F outside is about 75% setting. I run out of Bly hot and on full. If you slow the flow down, the temp will increase. I am always hooked up when camping, so I let it run when showering. Also leave the grey water valve open when parked. You can turn it on and off while showering but be careful to point it away from you when turning it back on, just in case. If all is working well, you shouldn't get scalded...big if, though. I would suggest talking with the Girard tech in CA. There us a Gen III that us now being marketed and gas a much improved temp control system, etc. from what I've seen, you actually select the exact water temp you want and it automatically adjusts the burner. Talk with Kyle Johnston at 866.559.1221. Email is KyleJohnston@girardrv.com. Kyle is great - very knowledgeable. Good luck!

[Major Malfunction]

I got the chance to use mine thoroughly about a week ago. State park in PA with full hook ups. Was in the 50s outside and hooked to city water. Had to set the temperature control dial about halfway. Water gets hot at the shower head in about 10 seconds depending on how cold the incoming water in. There can only be so much rise in temperature in a given amount of time plus the water can only get so hot based on the inlet temperature. I believe you get a 50-70 degree rise.

First shower on city water was my first shower with it overall. No more navy showers!! Once I adjusted the faucets, I knew the sweet spot to get it where it needed to be. It was nice and like being at home. But you really want to run the water and get the temp where you want it before getting in the shower. So you will probably use a LOT more water doing this, but its worth it.

Then the entire campground lost water pressure. It was down to a trickle. Took all day, but I filled my onboard 40 gallon tank. All 3 of us were able to take quick steamy showers the next day without having to on/off/on and still had some water left over. And because it had dipped down into the upper 20s overnight, I had to turn the temperature control for the water heater to max because my onboard water was pretty cold.

So YES you can dry camp with it, but you are rolling the dice in terms of having enough water to get you through and having enough room in your grey tank for dishes, etc. Plus when I dry camp, I tend to fill my grey tank pretty quick. Call me a glamper, but I shy away from dry camping simply because I don't need the extra headaches of rationing water and my tanks filling while trying to enjoy my weekend. Some of my younger and best memories are camping in a tent with my friends, but at my age, GLAMPING ALL THE WAY!!

Full hookups, tankless hot water heater is a nice luxury. Dry camping, I think you are better off with a regular hot water heater. I pulled it off using just my onboard water tank, but I filled my grey tank pretty quick because you aren't doing a navy shower.

When I get a chance, I will post pictures of my install, wiring, etc for anyone interested in going down this road.

[ChateauV10]

Concept & Major, I appreciate the details from both of you! My wife and I decided we want the hot water when we want it!


I did an experiment this past week-end where I took off the shower head, taped a thermocouple to be in the flow and directed the flow into my 6 gallon water jug. Air temp was 74 degrees. Water temp built to 128 degrees after 40 seconds and was down to 122 at 1:50; at 2:30 it is was down to 107, at 3:00 it was 97 degrees and by the time I reached ~6 gallons at 4:28, the water temp was 85 degrees.


I need to plot the data, but it sort of answered the question of why I had gotten a bit chilly when I took a shower that morning with the new Camco shower head. The new Girard WH should be a HUGE improvement!


I think we will have the new Girard in for our Memorial Day campout starting on the 25th and be able to say more after that trip.
Cheers!