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Old 02-12-2022, 05:40 PM   #1
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Dexter leaf spring issues

Just wondering if anyone else is having issues with there leaf springs and components such as bushings/bolts ext. I have a 2014 35QB4 Silverback Fifth Whl by Cedar Creek, the 2nd year out with it a rear leaf spring fell apart going down the road and the whole axle shifted back on a 45 degree angle. Dexter was kind to come to my home after I managed to get there a rebuild both axles and all leaf springs I thought all was well until last fall I broke a back wet bolt pulling out of a parking lot. Can’t figure what’s going on Dexter not much help since warranty is expired, do you have to replace the brass bushings /wet bolts regularly? This is my 4th fiver since 1980 and have never had these issues in the past, but this is the first 40 footer with only 2 axles all the other had 3. Any input would be helpful. Thanks
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Old 02-12-2022, 07:55 PM   #2
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Not so uncommon! 2018 Cedar Creek 34RE.

We lost one in October on the road home near Needles California. A front shoulder bolt fell out. Front axle on one side turned 30 degrees. Hit the rear on one side. Destroyed the tires.

On ours the front shoulder bolt failed. Fellow who replaced everything for us, $6500, believes the factory installed the bolt improperly. Could not prove it.

Assuming you have the standard wet bolts and brass bearing, they should last a long time.

But, every now and then you should make sure they are as they should be.

At the service station we had the repairs done. The mechanic had a pile of broken suspension parts. Last one before ours was a 2021 model. He had four sets of suspension parts in the junk pile.
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Old 02-16-2022, 12:59 PM   #3
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Sounds like a common issue I agree but just don’t understand why they can’t make components like they did in the past? I guess it’s like building a house on sand no foundation ��
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Old 02-16-2022, 01:54 PM   #4
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I am really old.

I purchased some early steel and bolts from China in the 70's.

The iron workers were complaining about the connection bolts breaking. We then threw them all away.

There was a nationwide issue.

Too many bean counters out there.
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Old 02-17-2022, 11:05 AM   #5
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Suspension Upgrade

https://www.roadmasterinc.com/produc...mfort_ride.php
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Old 02-17-2022, 11:18 AM   #6
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Just speculation on potential reasons for this to happen. I retrofitted to wet bolts, and I have found some of them very difficult to grease. Without taking the load off of the springs, it is impossible to get them to take grease. It wouldn't be a long time before they start to wear if the get dry. It also could be the quality of the materials used. It's not like we haven't seen short cuts for cost savings in the RV industry ie. tires, delamination, roof installation, batteries, converters, etc.
I found a great deal of wear when I converted my shackles and bolts to the MorRyde equalizer and wet bolt system at 3 years old, with probably only 8 to 10 thousand miles on the trailer. I had a bunch of issues on my old 2000 Montana which made me paranoid about the stock setup on my new Crusader, which incidently only came with plastic bushings, and dry bolts. Shackles showed a lot of "ovaling" where the dry bolts pivoted inside the shackle, and the nylon/plastic bushings were all but disintegrated. Be sure to include regular inspection to your list of pre-trip duties.
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Old 02-17-2022, 11:28 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Comanchecreek View Post
Just speculation on potential reasons for this to happen. I retrofitted to wet bolts, and I have found some of them very difficult to grease. Without taking the load off of the springs, it is impossible to get them to take grease. It wouldn't be a long time before they start to wear if the get dry. It also could be the quality of the materials used. It's not like we haven't seen short cuts for cost savings in the RV industry ie. tires, delamination, roof installation, batteries, converters, etc.
I found a great deal of wear when I converted my shackles and bolts to the MorRyde equalizer and wet bolt system at 3 years old, with probably only 8 to 10 thousand miles on the trailer. I had a bunch of issues on my old 2000 Montana which made me paranoid about the stock setup on my new Crusader, which incidently only came with plastic bushings, and dry bolts. Shackles showed a lot of "ovaling" where the dry bolts pivoted inside the shackle, and the nylon/plastic bushings were all but disintegrated. Be sure to include regular inspection to your list of pre-trip duties.

Not unusual or unexpected. Unless "grease channels" are provided, either on bolt or in bushing, the orifice the grease is injected through forms a seal with the bushing. Removing weight releases this seal. Only alternative is to find a really high pressure grease gun. Sometimes hand operated, especially the pistol grip type, just can't generate enough pressure to break through this "seal".

In past years it was recommended that automotive "joints" be greased with weight removed by merely jacking up frame and let the suspension hang free.
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Old 02-17-2022, 11:36 AM   #8
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Only question I have about that style suspension would be that it throws all of the load on the rear spring support mounts. I have had them tear off on a previous rig. Just saying.
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Old 02-17-2022, 11:52 AM   #9
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We made the change to the above suspension on our 2019 36ck2 and absolutely loved the ride improvements!
Did the work myself in about 6 hours of work.
We had also had a major suspension failure, both front and back on the curb side brokeright at the shackles
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Old 02-17-2022, 11:56 AM   #10
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Only question I have about that style suspension would be that it throws all of the load on the rear spring support mounts. I have had them tear off on a previous rig. Just saying.
Some of the welded on spring mounts/hangars need to be reinforced regardless of whether used stock or aftermarket systems are added. Many mounts are merely a piece of flat-bar steel formed into a "U" and welded to the bottom of the frame flange. Almost no lateral support and they either bend, break, or both.

There have been several posts over the last few years showing how owners have reinforced these mounts for lateral support by either welding in angled braces or adding a piece of channel/tube from side to side.
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Old 02-17-2022, 03:34 PM   #11
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TitanMike; I did just that type of reinforcing on my 2000 Montana after the right rear one was torn off while crossing a cattleguard at a fast speed. They just don't show that in the video that was posted. I sure wouldn't trust the hangars on my Crusader to withstand that load.
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Old 02-17-2022, 04:20 PM   #12
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Only question I have about that style suspension would be that it throws all of the load on the rear spring support mounts. I have had them tear off on a previous rig. Just saying.
What your saying here just isn't correct. Weight is a vertical force and even with the spring sliding the vertical force is still being placed on both ends of the spring.
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Old 02-17-2022, 05:09 PM   #13
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Only question I have about that style suspension would be that it throws all of the load on the rear spring support mounts. I have had them tear off on a previous rig. Just saying.
No the front and rear springs are totally separate, the fact that each spring, front and back , are free to move independently makes this system act as an independent system. Easy way to see this is to jack up one of the wheels and watch the other. It won't move till the other is way, way off the ground. With this system you can actually lift all 4 wheels off the ground without any problems. ( not saying you should) and with the spring trapped in side the center slipper box you have more resistance to the spring pulling sideways when turning.
Yes the front and rear shackles should have a inverted v welded to give extra strength to the sides of the shackles.
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Old 02-17-2022, 09:21 PM   #14
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The downward force is being spread on EACH spring separately. The one end of each spring is anchored at one end and floats in the middle, allowing the spring to slip up as extra force is applied to ONLY the one tire/spring at a time. Not transferring to the other spring/wheel.
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Old 02-18-2022, 11:03 AM   #15
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Maybe they should go back to 3axles like I said before my last 3 fifth wheels no issues at all never had to crawl under my trailer and re-tourque bolts has mentioned in the Dexter manual that came with my trailer. Sounds like Dexter just passing the buck here🤪.
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Old 02-18-2022, 08:15 PM   #16
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Maybe they should go back to 3axles like I said before my last 3 fifth wheels no issues at all never had to crawl under my trailer and re-tourque bolts has mentioned in the Dexter manual that came with my trailer. Sounds like Dexter just passing the buck here🤪.
My friend had a leaf fail on his triple axle trailer. Maybe they could just slightly over design such a critical component so this doesn't happen.
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Old 02-18-2022, 08:48 PM   #17
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There are definitely lateral forces on the spring mounts. That is what keeps your axles in the proper position relative to the trailer. That's why the OP's axle shifted 45 degrees when the bolt broke. With a conventional spring setup, the equalizer center mount and the front and rear spring mounts share the load of the lateral forces on the axles. When you eliminate the center equalizer you shift the full lateral load to the front and rear mounts. I'm not saying this is not a good system with improved ride. I just worry that without reinforcing of the spring mounts, they could be torn loose by the forces. We all know how much effort the manufacturers put into making things strong. I know of several trailers that have had spring mounts severely bent or torn off, including my Montana. The cool part of that setup is the shocks. That probably accounts for 75 percent of the improvement all by itself.
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Old 02-19-2022, 09:29 AM   #18
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we just had a similar leaf spring failure. for whatever reason the bolt holding the spring leaved together broke. this allowed the smaller spring on the bottom to work loose. once they were gone the u-bolts holding the axle to the springs were loose and the axle shifted and bent.

we got the trailer to a rv suspension shop and they replaced all four leaf springs, the bent axle, equalizers, shackles, and installed wet bolts. they say they see this type of failure all the time. the tow company that did the tow also said this is a common failure. the suspension shop installed dexter components and said they are the best. but that may be simply because that is the brand they keep in stock.

nobody really ever explained how to inspect the suspension to look for signs of impending failure. you really can't see the details of the bolt that holds the leaves together. we were close to the weight limits but not overloaded. and we weren't traveling on a highway that had terrible potholes. who knows how this happens but apparently it does.
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Old 02-19-2022, 10:44 AM   #19
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The fellow who repaired my fifth wheel said, the small nut on the shoulder bolt first breaks and falls off.

As you merrily drive a while the tires are slightly misaligned and wear funny. I saw it but, thought it was the odd campsite we were in. Stupid!

When the bolt finally falls out, well, you know what it looks like. The picture. We were lucky a passing motorist saw it happen and told me to stop.

We were fortunate the axle was not damaged.

As you found out. This is not real uncommon.

The big killer was four new commercial trailer tires were $2500 during last fall. $1500 for the tow. $2700 for the suspension.

Ours was repaired in less than 24 hours. Camped out in the Shell station.
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Old 02-20-2022, 10:40 AM   #20
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My recommendation is regular inspection. I know it's a pain to crawl under the trailer, but it can save you a giant tow bill, and a huge hassle while on the road. Familiarize yourself with how things look when in good shape. Note in your mind the position and shape of the spring mounts and look at all of the welds. Look for signs of cracking, and rust on those welds. Notice the spring shackle bolts, do you see any portion of the hole they go through at the top of the bolt. Do you see any missing nuts. Are there any signs of anything hitting the frame. Be sure to also look for rubber damage (if equipped) an your equalizers. Look for cracked, or sagging leaves in each spring pack. Sometimes the leaves will not be aligned with each other. They will usually crack behind or in front of where the u bolts hold them to the axle, although I have seen them break in almost any location. It's also a good time to inspect your tires and notice any uneven wear, or tread separation, or severe weathering you may not have noticed. Not everything can be prevented, or noticed, but you will find how "trained" your "untrained eye" can become when you look at things on a regular basis. While it doesn't guarantee freedom from problems, it improves your odds of catching them before they become a disaster.
There are many suspension upgrades that can also improve your odds. Some have been mentioned above. Others are MorRyde wet bolts and shackle kits, CRE3100 and 4100 equalizers, and X Factor cross braces. Again, while no guarantee, these all eliminate some problems that can cause issues on the road. You can always throw a ton of money at the problem, but the first step is to get under there and look.
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