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Old 09-03-2009, 12:20 PM   #1
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Bunk end water fix...cheap!

I am a machine designer living in Dover, NH. I happen to be on shutdown this week and spent some time thinking about the lousy seals that all manufacturers use for their tent ends on hybrid TTs. Actually the seals are OK its the surfaces they mate to that are far too irregular to give the seal a chance to work. Then there's the issue (with Rockwood at least) of putting poorly installed screw heads right under the sealing surface. This is a two part fix and it will stand up to a hurricane. First put caulk (white silicone) on your finger and fill every screw head where the screw driver tip goes and under every screw head to completely fill any voids then wipe them off with your finger in the direction of the seal. I have attached a link to my photo gallery that shows everything I'm describing. Now go to home depot and for $7 get two 10' lengths of 2" SCH 40 PVC pipe. I spent a fair amount if time with my CAD program optimizing the pipe size and angle of cut to get the best water shedding effect. What I have done in essence is slice a chunk out of a 90" long PVC pipe so that it hangs from the gutter over the bunk end door. The chunk I removed is 1/4 or 90 degrees of the pipe (see photos). The effect this has is that all water now either goes into the gutter or off the front of the pipe without any chance of getting to the top horizontal seal. I don't care how careful you are at closing those ends, THEY WILL LEAK! The water on the top edge just doesn't go off either end it seeps past screw heads and irregularities in the paint and welds and ends up on top of the main inner seal where it finds its way to the tent material and bunk end where it rots the wood. We had a good rain storm last week but not anything serious. The next day I stood on a ladder and dried up the exterior water from the outer seal. My wife then opened the ends very slowly and there was plenty of water sitting on the big black inner seal and water that had made it to the tent itself (only on the front angled bunk). This is a three week old 2010 19' Roo. Supposedly with the best seal system currently available. My solution is to keep the damn rain away from that top seal, problem solved. I have found that the vertical side seals actually can work only of you make sure there isn't anything causing gaps that the seal can't adjust to (like screw heads). I am currently working on a tie-down system so I can travel with these in place because the wind driven rain while traveling is also an issue but I think I have a way to do it completely safely. More to follow. I hope this helps and cuts down on the thriving bunk-end replacement business ;-)

For all photos of this project...

http://s105.photobucket.com/albums/m...20Water%20Fix/
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Old 09-08-2009, 12:09 PM   #2
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I like it! Simple and effective! Keep us updated on the tie down system
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Old 09-08-2009, 01:51 PM   #3
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The 1959 Buick 2-door had a framlees window with a chrome "visor" that was Spring loaded. When you opened the door,the visor would flip up out of the way, It didn't matter if the window was closed or not. and when the door was shut the visor would flip back down into place. If you and your CAD could design something like that and get a copywright on it, you could make alittle bit of change...
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Old 09-09-2009, 07:01 PM   #4
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The travel bracket is in the works now. Stay tuned.
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Old 09-24-2009, 10:35 AM   #5
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I finally got around to making the water shield hold-down straps. I can't imagine a condition that these could make these come off now. I tried many methods of securing these while traveling because towing in the rain always causes a leak along the top even with the extra caulk I have added. With there installed the bunk end seals are no longer an issue in any conditions. Hope this help someone else.

http://s105.photobucket.com/albums/m...20Water%20Fix/

SPRING NOTE:::::::
I have found it necessary to add one last line of defense after this springs flooding rains. Take white duct tape and stick it into the little (as in useless) gutter above the door then attach the vinyl so that it hangs over the gutter as a flap. This keeps any water that ends up under the tube to still fall past the top horizontal seal and down the door face. The tube with nylon straps keeps this in place while traveling. An additional benefit is with the tent end out this flap hangs down to keep rain away from the top edge of the tent material where it meets the camper body. The pictures will help explain this.
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Old 04-09-2010, 10:04 AM   #6
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Wow...the imagination and inventiveness of the people on the forum never ceases to amaze me! Very good idea!! I will be making these next weekend!!! Thanks for the fantastic pics too!!
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Old 04-09-2010, 11:59 AM   #7
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bunk end seals

I had 08 roo 21ss .I took all the round head screws out i took a driil bit and counter sunk all the holes a bit i then put flathead stainless steel screws in every hole they were all nice and flush put some clear seam sealer over all the screws sealed great with new white seals.I now have a 2011 rockwood ultra lite 2304s.
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Old 05-01-2010, 02:51 PM   #8
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The rest of the story...

It was the day to wake up the beast and I was able to take some photos of the last and FINAL "water in the bunk ends" mod I have made. This is in addition to the PVC pipes shown earlier in the photos. With this addition a garden hose on full (from above) causes NO leaks. Although the pipes helped there is still a hard enough rain that can overwhelm the system. The photos on PhotoBucket are in reverse order so go to the last page and work backwards.

The rear (vertical) bunk end has had a flared lip added just above the hinge with some white duct tape and the vinyl bathtub edge sealing material you can get at home depot. This small lip deflects the worst rain from getting into the hinge. At the top I used white duct tape, with half of it tucked into the gutter (clean with alcohol first...you and the gutter) and the other half stuck to a 4" wide continuous strip of clear vinyl. What this does is that no mater how hard the rain, any water that gets past the PVC thing stays completely away from the top end seal and just pours down the door which is half of the battle with these things leaking.

The front bunk I did the same thing with the vinyl at the top and went one extra step at the bottom. To keep wind driven rain (while driving) out of the hinge area I used duct tape, the bath tub stuff and velcro to close off that area. This might all look like a bit much and that I need to find a hobby but at least my bunk ends aren't a spongy mess and come selling time it should pay off.

In addition anyone with an 2009 or newer Roo is probably aware of the singing propane tanks. There are two photos of the labels on the pigtails that Rockwood sent me. I can attest that with water heater, cabin heater and all stove burners running the sound is completely gone!

Note:

The positioning of the front end's velcro is important. If it is any higher the bottom bunk edge chops the vinyl up. Where I have it the vinyl just buckles when the end comes down.

Good luck all!

http://s105.photobucket.com/albums/m...20Water%20Fix/
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Old 05-02-2010, 10:05 AM   #9
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Although I hold little hope of ever getting my 23ss repaired, if it does happen I will use your good ideas to help prevent future water damage. If I had only known the bunk end problems when I bought the Roo in 2007, or if Forest River or my dealer had notified me of the problem in 2007, 2008, 2009, or 2010. Words fail me. Again, thanks for the good idea.
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Old 03-27-2012, 08:27 PM   #10
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Pixleys - I would like to see the mods you have done to your bunkends, it appears all the links to photbucket are broken or have been remvoed. Is there anyway you can post them again to someplace? I think i have a good understanding from reading the thread but pictures sure would help :-)
thanks
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Old 03-28-2012, 07:07 AM   #11
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I have updated all the photos related to the Roo repair...

This is a mix of many photos mostly related to leak redesign. I no longer have any issues after many, many hours. The solution ended up being the tubing cover, vinyl and white duct tape. All must be applied. Any one alone does't do it. I applied this fix to both ends although the problem only existed on the front door. Sorry to those of you who have the new 2012 end design that apparently has its own issues.

Good luck all...

Camper Fix pictures by pixleys - Photobucket
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Old 03-30-2012, 10:12 PM   #12
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pixleys I am very interested as well as i just bought a 2012 233s and would like to prevent this from the start.
thank you .
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Old 03-31-2012, 09:35 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pixleys View Post
This is a mix of many photos mostly related to leak redesign. I no longer have any issues after many, many hours. The solution ended up being the tubing cover, vinyl and white duct tape. All must be applied. Any one alone does't do it. I applied this fix to both ends although the problem only existed on the front door. Sorry to those of you who have the new 2012 end design that apparently has its own issues.

Good luck all...

Camper Fix pictures by pixleys - Photobucket
Pixley - Nice repairs and I am glad to hear you have no more leaks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pony express View Post
pixleys I am very interested as well as i just bought a 2012 233s and would like to prevent this from the start.
thank you .
Pony, although Pixley's modifications are impressive, you shouldn't have to do this for several reasons.

First, the seals and bunk ends are different for 2012/2013 than the 2010's. In fact, your 2012 is different from my 2012 so I would advise against jumping the gun and assuming you need to make these changes.

Second: We haven't experienced any of the problems described in the first 2009 post and, at this point, I don't feel the need to do this.

Last, you will be under warranty if you do experience leaks.
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Old 04-02-2012, 10:29 AM   #14
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There is one othe thing that hybrid owners aren't aware of, condensation. The sure way to tell is buy the heads of the small staples found on the mattress side of the door down near the hinge. What happens is that the inside of the door is not completely filled therefore there is air and moisture in the air inside all of these doors. As the colder, damp night air gets inside the doors followed by the sun beating down on the door the moisture condensates on the inside of the door, trickles down to the hinge area and rust will creep up the little staples finally showing on the mattress side of the door. I have seen Roos two weeks from manufacture date with this issue. I have never seen a Roo hybrid that did not have the rusty little staples. I'll bet that anyone that looks will see this. The angled front doors all have this problem although I have seen it in the rear. Just compare the staples near the hinge with others found on the door. This almost constant mositure is rotting away at all our doors even if slower than an actual leak. Without completely filling the voids in the door this will continue. I have thought of minmally expalding great stuff injected into hand drilled holes on the mattress side to cure this but have not done it yet. Adding proper venting on the mattress side might also resolve this by giving the moisture somewhere to go. Just my 2 cents.
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Old 07-20-2012, 08:09 AM   #15
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Thank you Pixleys.
FWIW.... My 2012 23SS has been in for warranty work twice for this exact same issue. It still hasn't been fixed by the dealer, but I'm still working with them. It won't be long, however, from what I can see, before I'm going to need to take these steps (or something similar) to stop the leaks. The trailer has a seven year warranty so I'm a little leery of doing it just yet, but I see nothing here that would void that. I'll check with the service dept the next time I take the trailer to them.
From what I've seen here, the design from 2006/2007 is basically the same as my 2012. I see one small difference that would be easily adjusted for.
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Old 09-24-2012, 11:52 AM   #16
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hello pixleys,

Link to pics not working! can you re-post please i have a 2009 Shamrock 233 with the 3 beds loan roten at the bottom! my finger went right trough! how to fix that? see pics.

TX
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Old 09-25-2012, 09:32 AM   #17
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Try here...

Camper Fix pictures by pixleys - Photobucket
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Old 09-25-2012, 06:09 PM   #18
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This is why they should stop making hybrids with these bunk doors. Water always gets in somehow. I can't believe how rotten it is for the year it is.
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Old 09-25-2012, 08:06 PM   #19
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Tell me about it KWillmott, i can't believe it to how rotten it is for a 3 years old RV! Does any body knows if i can claim something at Forest River.

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Old 09-25-2012, 08:56 PM   #20
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This is a great fix, but ridicules that it’s required. My 2003 Starcraft Hybrid (that we had for three years) never had a bed leak issue, even when pulling in driving rain. FR needs to ditch their current design and go back to the drawing board.
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