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Old 07-14-2020, 04:57 AM   #1
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2716g owners, fridge in summer hot weather only 50 degrees?!

I had my tech look at my Dometic inside ammonia absorption refrigerator since it doesn't want to go below 50 degrees either on propane or electric expect when it's under 80 degrees F. out of the sun.

He tested in his shop bay and the refrigerator kept 32 degrees F all day.

As soon as I tested it at 84 degrees F. out in my driveway it was 44 degrees without any opening the door. With opening the door and checking every hour or so it went back up to 50 degrees F.

Is this what others are experiencing or are you able to keep it below 40 degrees in all temps.

I'm installing the Titan 120mm refrigerator fan in the hope in getting this refrigerator to operate correctly.

Thanks for your help.
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Old 07-14-2020, 11:17 AM   #2
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I'm assuming you have the Dometic 4223 1.9 cu ft fridge (or something very similar). This thread (https://www.forestriverforums.com/fo...ge-104964.html) details what I went through to cure the dangerous heat build-up in the top of the outside fridge compartment, and the inconsistent cooling.

The problems stem from the Rockwood/Flagstaff install not meeting Dometic standards, AND the Dometic vents being very poor at getting natural convection going.

First thing I would encourage is use of a wireless thermometer ($10 at Walmart) so you don't have to open the door to check the inside temp.

You also want to avoid heat being trapped in the fridge compartment - mine made the plywood between the sink and fridge compartments hot enough to scare DW when she discovered it. So I sealed off most of the top of the compartment - anything above the vent - with Reflectix (from Home Depot). DW used the left-over Reflectix to line our coolers, which doubled the longevity of the ice in the cooler. Good stuff.

But the Reflectix still doesn't get the air flowing through those vents. Following the lead of others, I found a 1200 RPM 120mm computer case fan, and tie-wrapped it to the upper vent. The fan made a much bigger than expected difference. With the fan, I could consistently get below freezing within 2 days or less on any source. Propane or AC would have be dialed back to prevent food freezing - even in Waco, Texas.

I've had the similar consistency problems with the 3.1 cu ft fridge in the High Wall A-frame. Not as common or as often, but I've had trips where it wouldn't stay below 40. I've done all the same mods - all that's left is to remove the stock fan in the throat that doesn't come on until too late. I have 2 120mm 1200 RPM fans for the upper grill (will use tie wraps again), and I'm just going to put a manual switch on them until I see how well it works.

Hope this helps
Fred W
now 2019 Flagstaff T21TBHW A-frame
prev 2014 Rockwood A122 A-frame
camping Colorado and adjacent states one weekend at a time
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Old 07-14-2020, 07:44 PM   #3
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Go to pop-up portal.com there are posts that show you how to make a fan mod for those refrigerators I did it on my popup kept it in the high twenties
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Old 07-14-2020, 09:22 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by Gdub2 View Post
Go to pop-up portal.com there are posts that show you how to make a fan mod for those refrigerators I did it on my popup kept it in the high twenties
I made my own fan mod on my 2007 Starcraft pop up 13 years ago, didn't think I'd have to 13 years later on a camper 2x the cost.

Absolutely ridiculous how this camper was put together!!

They caulked in the burner box so it can't be removed to clean the burner. NOW they put the 12 volt connections where they can't be accessed. Telling now why they put a pig tail on the 12 volt connections to be closed end crimped to the camper 12 volt wiring!

I ran out of closed end crimps so now I can't wire in my fans I just installed. I planned on just wiring to the terminal board.

Forest River absolutely installed this refrigerator incorrectly and can't believe anyone's works correctly. The exhaust from the burner is above the vent cover opening, where it just gathers at the top of the enclosure where the fins can never cool off enough to keep the temp at 40 or below except in cold outside temps with a lot of wind.

Then they had absolutely no head room as Dometic requires. The top of the fridge is right at the bottom of fridge counter top with sheet metal protecting the counter top. The top of the counter top is extremely hot but it's in so tight, no other insulation can be put in there to keep the heat off of the counter top.

EXTREMELY disappointed in the build quality of this unit.

Even the rear of the refrigerator was so tight the fans I installed barely fit.

I guess it's off to find some closed end crimps after work.

Thankfully, the fans do look like they will fix the problem but Forest River should had installed them. Someone could get food poisoning the way the refrigerator works from the factory.


Thanks everyone for your help.
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Old 07-14-2020, 09:32 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by pgandw View Post
I'm assuming you have the Dometic 4223 1.9 cu ft fridge (or something very similar). This thread (https://www.forestriverforums.com/fo...ge-104964.html) details what I went through to cure the dangerous heat build-up in the top of the outside fridge compartment, and the inconsistent cooling.

The problems stem from the Rockwood/Flagstaff install not meeting Dometic standards, AND the Dometic vents being very poor at getting natural convection going.

First thing I would encourage is use of a wireless thermometer ($10 at Walmart) so you don't have to open the door to check the inside temp.

You also want to avoid heat being trapped in the fridge compartment - mine made the plywood between the sink and fridge compartments hot enough to scare DW when she discovered it. So I sealed off most of the top of the compartment - anything above the vent - with Reflectix (from Home Depot). DW used the left-over Reflectix to line our coolers, which doubled the longevity of the ice in the cooler. Good stuff.

But the Reflectix still doesn't get the air flowing through those vents. Following the lead of others, I found a 1200 RPM 120mm computer case fan, and tie-wrapped it to the upper vent. The fan made a much bigger than expected difference. With the fan, I could consistently get below freezing within 2 days or less on any source. Propane or AC would have be dialed back to prevent food freezing - even in Waco, Texas.

I've had the similar consistency problems with the 3.1 cu ft fridge in the High Wall A-frame. Not as common or as often, but I've had trips where it wouldn't stay below 40. I've done all the same mods - all that's left is to remove the stock fan in the throat that doesn't come on until too late. I have 2 120mm 1200 RPM fans for the upper grill (will use tie wraps again), and I'm just going to put a manual switch on them until I see how well it works.

Hope this helps
Fred W
now 2019 Flagstaff T21TBHW A-frame
prev 2014 Rockwood A122 A-frame
camping Colorado and adjacent states one weekend at a time
Looks like the 4223 2.5 Cu ft refrigerator, thanks. I installed the Titan fans seen here which are dual 120mm fans. Just needing crimps to get power to them.

You were right, Forest River really installed this incorrect. Surprised it works at all.

Thanks for the help.
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Old 07-14-2020, 10:49 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Gdub2 View Post
Go to pop-up portal.com there are posts that show you how to make a fan mod for those refrigerators I did it on my popup kept it in the high twenties
Be careful with your suggested web site, I had a post deleted and was given a private message reprimand for "mining" new members for suggesting the same site to a new FRF member who was looking for suggestions to keep their hybrid cooler/warmer.
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Old 07-15-2020, 01:31 PM   #7
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Since the heat created by the refrigerators and the outside temperature cannot vent naturally due to the lack of a roof vent, we had an auxiliary fan installed at the top vent. It works great to help keep the temperature within range. With these trailers, they should be standard equipment!
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Old 07-15-2020, 08:06 PM   #8
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Since the heat created by the refrigerators and the outside temperature cannot vent naturally due to the lack of a roof vent, we had an auxiliary fan installed at the top vent. It works great to help keep the temperature within range. With these trailers, they should be standard equipment!
Yep, that's where I installed them. Just waiting for it to stop raining so I can connect them to DC power.

Bought some shorty small screw drivers and some closed end crimps, what's ever easiest, to connect power. Like to just add to terminal if screwdrivers can squeeze in there and get a strong bite.

Thanks.
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Old 07-15-2020, 09:00 PM   #9
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Hi Mike, I added a temperature switch that I mounted to the tube on the outlet of the condenser coil. I used a piece of metal plumbing strap that already has holes in it. This way it can cycle on/off as needed. This is what I used: SUPCO THERMOSTAT 74T12 STYLE 310708 AT021. Beats having to turn another switch on.
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Old 07-15-2020, 11:44 PM   #10
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I gave up on the Dometic fridge's. They struggle in upper 80 degree days(and my convertor fan ran continuously). I had the cooling unit replaced under warranty and the results were the same. Glad I'm dry docked and have a 18cf fridge on my porch. Use the USELESS fridge for airtight storage!
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Old 07-16-2020, 08:52 AM   #11
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Hi Mike, I added a temperature switch that I mounted to the tube on the outlet of the condenser coil. I used a piece of metal plumbing strap that already has holes in it. This way it can cycle on/off as needed. This is what I used: SUPCO THERMOSTAT 74T12 STYLE 310708 AT021. Beats having to turn another switch on.
Yep, my fan kit came with a temp sensor (TC or RTD?) and a temp controller with auto and manual modes.

Thanks.
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Old 07-16-2020, 08:55 AM   #12
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I gave up on the Dometic fridge's. They struggle in upper 80 degree days(and my convertor fan ran continuously). I had the cooling unit replaced under warranty and the results were the same. Glad I'm dry docked and have a 18cf fridge on my porch. Use the USELESS fridge for airtight storage!
Norcold fridges and AC units are so much better than Dometic. Carefree of Colorado awnings also are better than dometic. In fact all Dometic stuff is garbage IMO.
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Old 07-16-2020, 06:56 PM   #13
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Ok, done with my mod. The fans blow out the top vent fan hopefully pulling cold air through the bottom, through the top fins, and out the top vent.

Hopefully the refrigerator will work now. The temp controller system with the fans was $80 from Amazon. Expensive but if it works, it's worth it.

The fans are large but shallow. Deeper fans would not fit and these fans fit perfect. The attachment brackets wouldn't work with my vents so I used industrial grade, high temp wire zip ties.

Hopefully I won't have to move the temp sensor but I wanted to read enclosure heat not ammonia tubing heat.

Also I absolutely never attach low voltage signal wires to any AC cable/wires but in this case, I had no where else to attach cables. This refrigerator was literally shoe horned into this enclosure and why it wasn't installed correctly according to Dometic documentation.

I did have to use the closed end sealed crimps. Being that I could only fit a very small screwdriver to access the terminals for the DC supply voltage, I couldn't get enough torque on the screwdriver to even loosen the screw. So I had to use crimps which ultimately was the easiest way anyhow. I added zip ties to aid in keeping the wires from pulling out of the crimp and to keep the wires neat and tucked away.



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Old 07-16-2020, 07:55 PM   #14
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Ok, done with my mod. The fans blow out the top vent fan hopefully pulling cold air through the bottom, through the top fins, and out the top vent.

Hopefully the refrigerator will work now. The temp controller system with the fans was $80 from Amazon. Expensive but if it works, it's worth it.

The fans are large but shallow. Deeper fans would not fit and these fans fit perfect. The attachment brackets wouldn't work with my vents so I used industrial grade, high temp wire zip ties.

Hopefully I won't have to move the temp sensor but I wanted to read enclosure heat not ammonia tubing heat.

Also I absolutely never attach low voltage signal wires to any AC cable/wires but in this case, I had no where else to attach cables. This refrigerator was literally shoe horned into this enclosure and why it wasn't installed correctly according to Dometic documentation.

I did have to use the closed end sealed crimps. Being that I could only fit a very small screwdriver to access the terminals for the DC supply voltage, I couldn't get enough torque on the screwdriver to even loosen the screw. So I had to use crimps which ultimately was the easiest way anyhow. I added zip ties to aid in keeping the wires from pulling out of the crimp and to keep the wires neat and tucked away.



Sure looks like it should.

One question in my mind though. Is the "chimney" area sealed off from the rest of the interior with the only possible exit for the air being blown in is out through the upper vent?

If not then it would seem that hot air, as well as burner exhaust, could end up inside.

I haven't tackled mine yet but am initially leaning toward mounting fans under my rooftop vent so the heat and exhaust is sucked up and out.

Just curious about the "chimney".
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Old 07-16-2020, 09:14 PM   #15
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Sure looks like it should.

One question in my mind though. Is the "chimney" area sealed off from the rest of the interior with the only possible exit for the air being blown in is out through the upper vent?
No, the air blown "in", goes into the bottom vent, and the air is pulled up through the fins than blown "out" through the upper vent.

The burner does have a stack pointed out toward the upper vent but it is inside the enclosure. This is how the small ammonia absorption refrigerators do it. It is not the same design as a larger ammonia absorption refrigerator that you find in a travel trailer.
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Old 07-16-2020, 09:17 PM   #16
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So far so good. I started out at ~80 degree F. The outside got dark and cooled to around 73 degree F. at the time I checked the temp. It was a whole 1.5 hours.

The temp was reading 38 degrees F. inside the refrigerator after only 1.5 hours!

There's absolutely no heat at all inside the refrigerator enclosure. No heat can be detected even above the burner stack. The metal flashing above the burner, on the roof wall (or bottom of cabinet top), is completely cool and not warm at all.

The fans pull a lot of air. I do have them at max right now. I will test later how the auto function in the controller keeps temp. Right now I just want to see if it works and so far so good.
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Old 07-17-2020, 04:46 PM   #17
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Ok, camper overnight on full fan speed (6 out of 6) got down to 26 degrees F.

At 5am I turned the fan down to 4 out of 6.

Outside is 90+ degrees in full sun. Camper inside 100+ degrees because all windows closed while not home.

With 4 out of 6 LED Fan Speed, the refrigerator was 34 degrees F. Excellent cooling.

Now I have put it in Auto Mode. Disappointed that controller only uses LEDs for manual mode. Auto mode has no indication where fan speed is and all LEDs are off with the fan running.

For $80, well worth not getting food poisoning or throwing out $100 of food. We did that in the past when temps were found around 50 - 60 degrees.

Angry that refrigerator was installed incorrectly against manufacturer's directions and won't operate correctly because of that. Fine, if they supplied the fan from the factory to make up for their installation shortcomings. As is, inexcusable.
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Old 07-18-2020, 11:59 AM   #18
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Okay, I've had it running in "AUTO" mode almost a day now which the temp controller is in control using the temp sensor which appears to be a TC (thermocouple).

It's mid 80s with full sun right now. Opened the refrigerator and says 30 degrees F. Very pleased with the performance of these fans. I can now use my expensive ammonia absorption refrigerator as a refrigerator instead of a beverage cooler.

I like this fan setup much better than the fan setup I installed in my previous Starcraft 2406.
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Old 07-18-2020, 01:31 PM   #19
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BTW, here's my 2007 Starcraft 2406 refrigerator mod.

As you can see, the fan wasn't designed to go on the vent cover but was designed to mount so that it blew air through the fins. I couldn't attach it to the baffle on that Starcraft as there's was no room or structural strength so had to attach it to the side.

It didn't cool no where near as well as these Titan fans obviously. Plus it had no controller, it was full speed all the time with just a switch.

Plus looks like the Starcraft refrigerator, which had less Cubic Feet was a lot smaller physically.

2007 Starcraft 2406 mod.


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2019 Ford F150 Race Red XLT Sport, CC, 4WD, 145" WB, 3.5L Ecoboost, 10 speed, 3.55 Locking Axle, 1830# Payload, 12,700# Tow Rating, pulling a 2020 Rockwood Premier 2716G Pop Up, with a 14' box. Go through Indiana Dunes NP 5X/week! Previously had 2012 Jayco Jay Flight 26BH and 2008 Jayco Jay Flight 19BH Travel Trailers. Also previously had 2007 Starcraft 2406 Pop Up with 12' box and bathroom, Previously had 2005 Rockwood 2290 Pop Up with 12' box and porta potty cabinet.
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Old 07-18-2020, 01:49 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Mike91 View Post
BTW, here's my 2007 Starcraft 2406 refrigerator mod.

As you can see, the fan wasn't designed to go on the vent cover but was designed to mount so that it blew air through the fins. I couldn't attach it to the baffle on that Starcraft as there's was no room or structural strength so had to attach it to the side.

It didn't cool no where near as well as these Titan fans obviously. Plus it had no controller, it was full speed all the time with just a switch.

Plus looks like the Starcraft refrigerator, which had less Cubic Feet was a lot smaller physically.

2007 Starcraft 2406 mod.


The problem with fans that do not have a shroud, such as this one is about half of the air flow gets pushed out to the sides which cause turbulence thus reducing the amount of air pushed perpendicular to the blades.
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