Forest River Forums

Forest River Forums (https://www.forestriverforums.com/forums/)
-   Electrical, Charging Systems & Solar (https://www.forestriverforums.com/forums/f218/)
-   -   MagNUM MS2012 WITH 50A? (https://www.forestriverforums.com/forums/f218/magnum-ms2012-with-50a-99422.html)

Appalachian Ed 01-16-2016 01:42 PM

MagNUM MS2012 WITH 50A?
 
I am trying to decide on the inverter/charger I want to purchase. The Magnum Energy 2012 is at the top of my list. I have a question regarding a possible concern. This unit has a transfer switch built in (I like the simplicity of that). I have 50amp service (Rockwood 8289WS). When I look at the specifications it states under Transfer relay capability "2 legs at 30 A for 120 V/30A". I like the 2 legs which seems to make sense for split phase circuit, but I will have 50 amps on each line. I have read several blogs where folks are using this for 50 amp service but this seems to say I might be overloading the relay switch. I am not an electrical engineer so am I missing something? I believe Magnum to be top notch and would be surprised if they did not make this for 50 amp service. Can I use this unit for 50 amp service? Everything else is exactly what I want (except for the Magnum price :crying:) I have searched and cannot find an explanation. I will probably call Magnum on Monday but thought I would like your thoughts on this subject.

While I'm at it, I have a second question. I have a PI HW50C Surge protector. I believe I would install this unit between the surge protector and the power distribution panel. Do you agree or is there a reason I should put this before the surge protector?

Thanks

Kenny kustom 01-16-2016 04:58 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Same boat as me. I'm putting in the msh3012.

50A rig.

You must use a sub panel.
Attachment 97898

I have spoken to many people about trying to run the whole rig, but alas, I was defeated.

Getting the sub from blue sea systems. Not a final design, but here's mine. Attachment 97899


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

Kenny kustom 01-16-2016 05:26 PM

I'm ordering mine from imarineusa.com

They have the cheapest anywhere, and are an authorized dealer.

They have the 2012 for around 1200.

You could step up to the 3012 for an extra $300.

It's a 3k. Hybrid. It can combine your batt to help with the load, along with shore power.

Here is an excellent example.
My rig is 50A. Around here, all cg are 30A. Never been to a 50A campground.
I select 30a service on the remote, and if I need more than the 30A from the pole, the batts will help.

Like say, starting both ac at the same time, etc.

It's really the cats meow.


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

Appalachian Ed 01-16-2016 05:36 PM

I was looking at this one KennyKustom. I don't think it would work for me. It seems to only have 1 input from the AC power source. My 50amp service is dual phase so it has two "hot" wires. L1 and L2. This seems like it is for single phase 240 to get up to 60 amps. I'm no expert though so help me understand.

I already have a 50 amp panel in my rig, and a 50 amp PI surge protector. I just wanted to install an inverter that included a better charger than the WFCO OEM charger.

I think I must be missing something in all of this. Pretty much every unit I find that is all 3 (inverter, charger, transfer relay) in a single box says they are 30 amp on each of two lines. I can find 50 amp relay switches that are sold as a separate unit though?? I like the idea of all built together simply for simplicity of installation.

Kenny kustom 01-16-2016 05:41 PM

There is no unit on the planet that will allow you to cut your main 50a an wire the inverter inline.

Trust me. I've looked!!

I wanted to wire it the same way.

You must use a sub panel.

If you had a 30a rig, you could.


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

Appalachian Ed 01-16-2016 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kenny kustom (Post 1079685)
There is no unit on the planet that will allow you to cut your main 50a an wire the inverter inline.

Trust me. I've looked!!

I wanted to wire it the same way.

You must use a sub panel.

If you had a 30a rig, you could.


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

Sigh! I have seen your posts and know you know a lot more than I. Thanks Kenny. I guess I will have to piece it together. :crying: And interestingly I have found several outlets selling the unit (i.e. Solar Electric Supply) that state the unit supports 50 amp transfer relay?? Only looking at the specs told me otherwise.

So if I understand correctly, this means you are wiring separate outlets to plug into when the inverter is supplying power that run into a separate sub panel right? Or can you link into the existing outlets? I am looking to power 1 kitchen outlet, 1 AC TV, 1 outlet in bedroom and the microwave.

Kenny kustom 01-16-2016 05:56 PM

MagNUM MS2012 WITH 50A?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Appalachian Ed (Post 1079689)
Sigh! I have seen your posts and know you know a lot more than I. Thanks Kenny. I guess I will have to piece it together. :crying: And interestingly I have found several outlets selling the unit (i.e. Solar Electric Supply) that state the unit supports 50 amp transfer relay?? Only looking at the specs told me otherwise.

So if I understand correctly, this means you are wiring separate outlets to plug into when the inverter is supplying power that run into a separate sub panel right? Or can you link into the existing outlets? I am looking to power 1 kitchen outlet, 1 AC TV, 1 outlet in bedroom and the microwave.


I am pulling circuits from the main panel and wiring them into my sub panel. Quite easy.

You may not be able to be that selective of the specific outlet.

You may be powering more outlets. But that's ok.
Micro will be on its own.

If you look at the diagram I posted from the manual, it's really not that hard, but I am still having an electrician friend who owes me a few favours, come advise.



2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

spock123 01-16-2016 06:35 PM

Why not use a cheater box? I go in a lot of campgrounds that only has 30amp


Sent from my iPhone using Forest River Forums

Kenny kustom 01-16-2016 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spock123 (Post 1079722)
Why not use a cheater box? I go in a lot of campgrounds that only has 30amp


Sent from my iPhone using Forest River Forums


That would work, but the hybrid has a lot of other benefits.

Like being able to run a much smaller genny, when needed. The batts will assist in the starting of the ac.


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

spock123 01-16-2016 08:13 PM

But the cheater box only cost $80 bucks. Most of the campgrounds I go to has 50amp as well as 30amp. But to each his own.


Sent from my iPhone using Forest River Forums

Kenny kustom 01-16-2016 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spock123 (Post 1079795)
But the cheater box only cost $80 bucks. Most of the campgrounds I go to has 50amp as well as 30amp. But to each his own.


Sent from my iPhone using Forest River Forums


Inverter is needed anyways.
Cheater box won't help when running on generator.


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

spock123 01-16-2016 08:55 PM

My two Honda's will run my AC just fine


Sent from my iPhone using Forest River Forums

Kenny kustom 01-16-2016 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spock123 (Post 1079842)
My two Honda's will run my AC just fine


Sent from my iPhone using Forest River Forums


If you had the hybrid, and a decent battery bank, one Honda would be enough.


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

spock123 01-16-2016 09:46 PM

I have had my two Honda's for 8 years now. I feel like they are almost part of the family


Sent from my iPhone using Forest River Forums

silverback 35ts 01-18-2016 03:19 PM

how much power may be to much?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Appalachian Ed (Post 1079575)
I am trying to decide on the inverter/charger I want to purchase. The Magnum Energy 2012 is at the top of my list. I have a question regarding a possible concern. This unit has a transfer switch built in (I like the simplicity of that). I have 50amp service (Rockwood 8289WS). When I look at the specifications it states under Transfer relay capability "2 legs at 30 A for 120 V/30A". I like the 2 legs which seems to make sense for split phase circuit, but I will have 50 amps on each line. I have read several blogs where folks are using this for 50 amp service but this seems to say I might be overloading the relay switch. I am not an electrical engineer so am I missing something? I believe Magnum to be top notch and would be surprised if they did not make this for 50 amp service. Can I use this unit for 50 amp service? Everything else is exactly what I want (except for the Magnum price :crying:) I have searched and cannot find an explanation. I will probably call Magnum on Monday but thought I would like your thoughts on this subject.

While I'm at it, I have a second question. I have a PI HW50C Surge protector. I believe I would install this unit between the surge protector and the power distribution panel. Do you agree or is there a reason I should put this before the surge protector?

Thanks

First i want to post to links to pdfs that you should look at before you make a choice;

1)https://www.magnum-dimensions.com/sit...eet_revi_1.pdf

2)https://www.magnum-dimensions.com/sit...eet_revb_0.pdf

These two pdf's are for inverters you are looking at and ones you should be looking at. I do not know where you have been getting your info, but most folks should spend some serious time at company websites as most your work in the electric field have some great sites with a ton of info, next "BEFORE" you purchase anything CALL the company you have made a choice to purchase (and you second choice ) ALSO and then make your final choice. Most companies in this field are pretty good and trying to help you out with making the right choice or even after to get you out of trouble.

So i hope this helps in your quest and Happy camping

Appalachian Ed 01-18-2016 07:58 PM

Thanks Silverback. Those links are the pages I studied to realize the websites saying the MS2012 supports 50 amp service were wrong. The spec sheet you included clearly shows that. The -H version will work if I branch off the pannel with one 50 amp wire. I wanted to have the main line coming in both 50 amp feeds going through the relay switch. And I agree I will likely talk to the manufacturer. I might even call Magnum although the specs would make me uncomfortable if they told me it was okay to use on 50 amp service anyway. I might consider the -H version still although I am much less excited about this option. If I have to wire portions of the rig separately for the inverted power, I might go for a samlex at much less cost.

Thanks for the input.

Kenny kustom 01-18-2016 08:45 PM

I called.
They told me sub panel.


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

Appalachian Ed 01-18-2016 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kenny kustom (Post 1081292)
I called.
They told me sub panel.


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

That is what I am thinking now Kenny. Where are you mounting the subpanel? I Hate the thought of cutting a hole in the interior walls for one. I guess it could be installed in the basement storage although I would worry about having enough wire on the circuit you take off the main panel to reach the new panel and I would not like another connection from extenders. Your thoughts and a bit more detial on the connection plans would be appreciated.

Kenny kustom 01-18-2016 10:03 PM

I opened up a wall in the basement.
Found the stock controller on the floor. I am going to rebuild that " wall" ( really just 1/4 board covered w carpet) a bit further in.
Mount the inverter and sub on my new wall.
It will be no more than two feet from the back side of the panel.

It should turn out really nice.



2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS

Kenny kustom 01-18-2016 10:07 PM

MagNUM MS2012 WITH 50A?
 
1 Attachment(s)
Here's what is behind the " wall"
You can see every circuit going " up" to the interior panel. Attachment 98027


I may move that one pipe, and run it along the floor, just to clean it up a bit. I'll see, once the trailer is back home, and it's not -40.


2016 Sabre 36QBOK
2015 Ram 3500 CUMMINS


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:09 AM.