EPro Battery relocation and MPPT solar upgrade

[UT_Vol]

Hello All.

I have made some changes to my new EPro E20FBS Battery and Solar systems. As I dd not find a lot online and it was hard to chase down some wires I figured I would post up my work and findings here so that others may comment and or benefit from my sleuthing.

First off This is the initial Wiring diagram the best I can chase down and understand. There are a few Wires in the red boxes that I have theories on what they are but nothing definitive. Please feel free to comment if you know that they are.

Picture of unidentified wires.

I already had the panels installed before delivery in parallel. The PWM controller was just not efficient enough and my lithium batteries needed to be in the passthrough. My initial hope was just to do a replacement of the GoPower PWM controller in the same place that it was. Turns out the new MPPT controller was much bigger and had to be located closer to batteries in the passthrough also. Those the old PWM controller was just disconnected and left in place. The wires did provide me a way to patch the solar panels through to the front of the travel trailer without much fuss.

Here is the new wiring design.

I chose to leave most of the trailer wiring alone and only connect the DC trailer feed ad the 40A fuse from above. This made things much simpler and they could be done on the backing there in the passthrough. Some other design choices I made was to install the solar panels in series rather than in parallel. I also connected the "Solar on the side" connections in parallel with the rooftop solar array. This was done to allow me to get just a solar suitcase with no controller and feed it into my current MPPT controller. I added a dual pole disconnect to be able to remove the solar panels from the system. Due to the fact that the 2 panel arrays may be different voltage I installed Blocking Diodes to prevent damage to other equipment and kept the 30Amp and 20 Amp fuse protections.
I chose the Renogy 60A MPPT controller in order to keep things on the same app as my current 200Ah Renogy battery. It is sized to handle 900W of PV for the 12V system.

Here are the pictures of the Final product after install before putting up Panel protections.

Future Upgrades will be adding a 2nd 200Ah Battery and also picking up the Renogy 400W Solar Suitcase panels. This should sufficiently do most of my boon docking needs. I may also upgrade the Inverter from the 1800W to a 3000W unit.

I hope this helps some in the future and look forward to any discussion about what I did.

 

[Aussieguy]

you are correct in worrying about mismatched voltage BUT I don't think diode is the answer.


Not a expert on solar panels
but I figure we don't have the luxury of multiple strings with a lots of panels

so adding any mismatched equipment together is just asking for losses that we cant afford... Keep strings matched and/or separate KISS
unless you are expert in this stuff

blocking diodes I believe stops a shaded panels (already matched into a string) from dragging down the array

If you put 2 mismatched panel together the will burn up diodes as it is always working?

https://diysolarforum.com/threads/blocking-diode-question-please.51248/page-3

---------------------------------------------
what size watts and voltage are the panels?


better off using the OLD pmw if the panels are not a good match
see if you can attach some sort of easy connector ...
IF.... your ground panel has it's own controller just utilize that direct to battery

looks like you got 10g wire on the 60amp OUT
right now with only 2 panels ... you probably won't see big amps
but if ever you get more panels and output amps....... swap the cable to about 4g

10g is probably OK for the panel to controller wires as you can put more panels in series to increase voltage (if you ever get more)

 

[TitanMike]

Hello All.

I have made some changes to my new EPro E20FBS Battery and Solar systems. As I dd not find a lot online and it was hard to chase down some wires I figured I would post up my work and findings here so that others may comment and or benefit from my sleuthing.

First off This is the initial Wiring diagram the best I can chase down and understand. There are a few Wires in the red boxes that I have theories on what they are but nothing definitive. Please feel free to comment if you know that they are.

Picture of unidentified wires.

I already had the panels installed before delivery in parallel. The PWM controller was just not efficient enough and my lithium batteries needed to be in the passthrough. My initial hope was just to do a replacement of the GoPower PWM controller in the same place that it was. Turns out the new MPPT controller was much bigger and had to be located closer to batteries in the passthrough also. Those the old PWM controller was just disconnected and left in place. The wires did provide me a way to patch the solar panels through to the front of the travel trailer without much fuss.

Here is the new wiring design.

I chose to leave most of the trailer wiring alone and only connect the DC trailer feed ad the 40A fuse from above. This made things much simpler and they could be done on the backing there in the passthrough. Some other design choices I made was to install the solar panels in series rather than in parallel. I also connected the "Solar on the side" connections in parallel with the rooftop solar array. This was done to allow me to get just a solar suitcase with no controller and feed it into my current MPPT controller. I added a dual pole disconnect to be able to remove the solar panels from the system. Due to the fact that the 2 panel arrays may be different voltage I installed Blocking Diodes to prevent damage to other equipment and kept the 30Amp and 20 Amp fuse protections.
I chose the Renogy 60A MPPT controller in order to keep things on the same app as my current 200Ah Renogy battery. It is sized to handle 900W of PV for the 12V system.

Here are the pictures of the Final product after install before putting up Panel protections.

Future Upgrades will be adding a 2nd 200Ah Battery and also picking up the Renogy 400W Solar Suitcase panels. This should sufficiently do most of my boon docking needs. I may also upgrade the Inverter from the 1800W to a 3000W unit.

I hope this helps some in the future and look forward to any discussion about what I did.

The blocking diodes will certainly prevent damage potential to other panels but the mismatch still exists. The MPPT controller will only work from the panel set feeding the highest potential and the other won't contribute until current flow reduces output voltage to that of the lower voltage panel. Current flow from lower voltage panel will reduce it's voltage output and this process could go back and forth, "confusing the MPPT controller."

The setup in the diagram MIGHT work OK but better way would be another Controller for portable panels. A few $$ more will produce more trouble free power.

Because portables can placed in the Sun I've wired mine in series using their own controller. My rooftop panels have their own as well.

 

[UT_Vol]

All agreed with your observations. From my general calculations the two arrays will not be to far off.

Rooftop array - configured in serial they will be about 45.56 Volts @ 9.65 Amps.

“Solar on the Side suitcase” - the one that I have planned is 47.2 Volts @ 10 Amps.

Between the 2 of these with only a minimal optimal Voltage difference, from what I have read this will result in a minimal difference that is handled by the Renogy MPPT controller.

Like has been said I may eventually need to separate the 2 arrays to produce a more effective charge to the battery bank. I am not 100% sure.

 

[UT_Vol]

you are correct in worrying about mismatched voltage BUT I don't think diode is the answer.


Not a expert on solar panels
but I figure we don't have the luxury of multiple strings with a lots of panels

so adding any mismatched equipment together is just asking for losses that we cant afford... Keep strings matched and/or separate KISS
unless you are expert in this stuff

blocking diodes I believe stops a shaded panels (already matched into a string) from dragging down the array

If you put 2 mismatched panel together the will burn up diodes as it is always working?

https://diysolarforum.com/threads/blocking-diode-question-please.51248/page-3

---------------------------------------------
what size watts and voltage are the panels?


better off using the OLD pmw if the panels are not a good match
see if you can attach some sort of easy connector ...
IF.... your ground panel has it's own controller just utilize that direct to battery

looks like you got 10g wire on the 60amp OUT
right now with only 2 panels ... you probably won't see big amps
but if ever you get more panels and output amps....... swap the cable to about 4g

10g is probably OK for the panel to controller wires as you can put more panels in series to increase voltage (if you ever get more)

The output is 8 GA wire at the moment as that was what Renogy recommended. I expect to upgrade this to 4 GA in the future, I seem to doubt the full amperage over the 8 GA wire.

 

[TitanMike]

All agreed with your observations. From my general calculations the two arrays will not be to far off.

Rooftop array - configured in serial they will be about 45.56 Volts @ 9.65 Amps.

“Solar on the Side suitcase” - the one that I have planned is 47.2 Volts @ 10 Amps.

Between the 2 of these with only a minimal optimal Voltage difference, from what I have read this will result in a minimal difference that is handled by the Renogy MPPT controller.

Like has been said I may eventually need to separate the 2 arrays to produce a more effective charge to the battery bank. I am not 100% sure.

Perhaps too late but Victron offers an MPPT solar controller with dual inputs and a single output. Solves the mismatched panel issue. I ended up with two separate controllers as my outside solar was already installed. Decided to just add the larger controller for the larger rooftop.

 

[Boomerweps]

Keep in mind basic rules with panels. Panels in series will produce power at the lowest panel’s amperage, with voltages added up. Panels in parallel will produce power based on the panels’ lowest voltage and the amps will be added up.
Watts are volts times amps.
When you have an extra SCC, it’s pretty easy to run a second panel to SCC to TT 12vdc to maximize power from mismatched panels.

 

[UT_Vol]

Keep in mind basic rules with panels. Panels in series will produce power at the lowest panel’s amperage, with voltages added up. Panels in parallel will produce power based on the panels’ lowest voltage and the amps will be added up.
Watts are volts times amps.
When you have an extra SCC, it’s pretty easy to run a second panel to SCC to TT 12vdc to maximize power from mismatched panels.

Yeah, that is kinda the backup plan. Assuming that this does not work to effectively. The calculations I did were based on the panel specs, which I think is best case scenario. This seems highly unlikely exspecially on the roof as the angles from the sun will be different. They totaled up to be

45.56 Volts and 19.65 Amps
Max 895.25 Watts

My main worry is that the panels on the roof would produce less than the 45.56 volts since they would not be completely angled as well as the suitcase and lower the effectiveness of those panels.

Another thought I had was to place a switch in place to disconnect the 2 separate arrays or maybe switch them individually to the other PWM SCC.

 

[Aussieguy]

All agreed with your observations. From my general calculations the two arrays will not be to far off.

Rooftop array - configured in serial they will be about 45.56 Volts @ 9.65 Amps.

“Solar on the Side suitcase” - the one that I have planned is 47.2 Volts @ 10 Amps.

Between the 2 of these with only a minimal optimal Voltage difference, from what I have read this will result in a minimal difference that is handled by the Renogy MPPT controller.

Like has been said I may eventually need to separate the 2 arrays to produce a more effective charge to the battery bank. I am not 100% sure.

measure the actual output voltage before you go rewiring etc to join the 2 together

using the "calculated" numbers it is only 5% which in a large system not a biggie ... smaller systems you want to eliminate as many losses as possible

suitcase panels... test the setup to include the wire/cable from panels to the trailer
some people have said they get good results from using a old 120v extension cord ... cut the ends off and add your fav connections
then measure your voltage so it includes any line loss.
-------------------------------------------------------------------

Looked for dual mppt input controllers as Titan said
looks like only for larger systems ... bummmer that would be nice

closest I came to find would be the Renogy dc-dc withe MPPT
but only at 40 amps ..... bummer too

-------------------------------------------------------------------
" Future Upgrades will be adding a 2nd 200Ah Battery and also picking up the Renogy 400W Solar Suitcase panels. "

If you use suitcase .. and they come with their own controller don't connect them to MPPT
connect them to the busbar or battery

 

[TitanMike]

measure the actual output voltage before you go rewiring etc to join the 2 together

using the "calculated" numbers it is only 5% which in a large system not a biggie ... smaller systems you want to eliminate as many losses as possible

suitcase panels... test the setup to include the wire/cable from panels to the trailer
some people have said they get good results from using a old 120v extension cord ... cut the ends off and add your fav connections
then measure your voltage so it includes any line loss.
-------------------------------------------------------------------

Looked for dual mppt input controllers as Titan said
looks like only for larger systems ... bummmer that would be nice

closest I came to find would be the Renogy dc-dc withe MPPT
but only at 40 amps ..... bummer too

-------------------------------------------------------------------
" Future Upgrades will be adding a 2nd 200Ah Battery and also picking up the Renogy 400W Solar Suitcase panels. "

If you use suitcase .. and they come with their own controller don't connect them to MPPT
connect them to the busbar or battery

The Victron multi-input MPPT controllers work just fine on small systems too. Designed for systems that might have periodically shaded panels and will take power from input with max potential.

Could be especially beneficial for installations where owner installed panels where the A/C unit can cast a shadow across one panel or the other, depending on sun angle. Also where panels are following slope of roof and one side us clearly favored but the sun.

 

[Aussieguy]

The Victron multi-input MPPT controllers work just fine on small systems too. Designed for systems that might have periodically shaded panels and will take power from input with max potential.

Could be especially beneficial for installations where owner installed panels where the A/C unit can cast a shadow across one panel or the other, depending on sun angle. Also where panels are following slope of roof and one side us clearly favored but the sun.

any links to these

only found one multi and it was for 450v and 100amps
looked like the size of a Multiplus 2 and cost about $1200 and was 48v out
https://www.victronenergy.com/solar-charge-controllers/smartsolar-mppt-rs-450-tr

 

[TitanMike]

any links to these

only found one multi and it was for 450v and 100amps
looked like the size of a Multiplus 2 and cost about $1200 and was 48v out
https://www.victronenergy.com/solar-charge-controllers/smartsolar-mppt-rs-450-tr

Apparently you overlooked this one for only $463USD @ Blue Marine.

Versions available for two or three pv arrays that do not need to be connected in parallel to then feed into a single pv input.

 

[Aussieguy]

Apparently you overlooked this one for only $463USD @ Blue Marine.

Versions available for two or three pv arrays that do not need to be connected in parallel to then feed into a single pv input.

Interesting controller
but I think I'll stick with 2 smaller ones... I got the room for 2 and then have some redundancy. If one controller dies I will still have some power

150 /70 looks good if you got limited room as you wont need a any combiner for 2 separate strings

btw finding this controller on Victron's site is a PITA
and getting the manual is even worse, would have like to see what they recommend for matching voltages on the 2 inputs?

good to know they are somewhat available

 

[Rob_CO]

Hello All.

I have made some changes to my new EPro E20FBS Battery and Solar systems. As I dd not find a lot online and it was hard to chase down some wires I figured I would post up my work and findings here so that others may comment and or benefit from my sleuthing.

First off This is the initial Wiring diagram the best I can chase down and understand. There are a few Wires in the red boxes that I have theories on what they are but nothing definitive. Please feel free to comment if you know that they are.

Picture of unidentified wires.

I already had the panels installed before delivery in parallel. The PWM controller was just not efficient enough and my lithium batteries needed to be in the passthrough. My initial hope was just to do a replacement of the GoPower PWM controller in the same place that it was. Turns out the new MPPT controller was much bigger and had to be located closer to batteries in the passthrough also. Those the old PWM controller was just disconnected and left in place. The wires did provide me a way to patch the solar panels through to the front of the travel trailer without much fuss.

Here is the new wiring design.

I chose to leave most of the trailer wiring alone and only connect the DC trailer feed ad the 40A fuse from above. This made things much simpler and they could be done on the backing there in the passthrough. Some other design choices I made was to install the solar panels in series rather than in parallel. I also connected the "Solar on the side" connections in parallel with the rooftop solar array. This was done to allow me to get just a solar suitcase with no controller and feed it into my current MPPT controller. I added a dual pole disconnect to be able to remove the solar panels from the system. Due to the fact that the 2 panel arrays may be different voltage I installed Blocking Diodes to prevent damage to other equipment and kept the 30Amp and 20 Amp fuse protections.
I chose the Renogy 60A MPPT controller in order to keep things on the same app as my current 200Ah Renogy battery. It is sized to handle 900W of PV for the 12V system.

Here are the pictures of the Final product after install before putting up Panel protections.

Future Upgrades will be adding a 2nd 200Ah Battery and also picking up the Renogy 400W Solar Suitcase panels. This should sufficiently do most of my boon docking needs. I may also upgrade the Inverter from the 1800W to a 3000W unit.

I hope this helps some in the future and look forward to any discussion about what I did.

This great! I am looking to upgrade the solar system that came with my ePro 19BH. Have been considering relocating the system to the pass through. Would you be willing to post a list of all the components in your system and label them in the photos? Thanks for the info

 

[TitanMike]

This great! I am looking to upgrade the solar system that came with my ePro 19BH. Have been considering relocating the system to the pass through. Would you be willing to post a list of all the components in your system and label them in the photos? Thanks for the info

Re: 3,000w inverter, are you sure you need one that big? What are you planning on running at the same time?

I am using a 2,000 watt (4,000 watt surge) inverter which for me is more than enough to run my microwave. That's my main use as I find it more battery friendly to heat coffee water on stove and power TV and Starlink directly from battery power.

I realize what works for me may not for others but if no need for the large inverter batteries will end up happier.

 

[Rob_CO]

Hello All.

I have made some changes to my new EPro E20FBS Battery and Solar systems. As I dd not find a lot online and it was hard to chase down some wires I figured I would post up my work and findings here so that others may comment and or benefit from my sleuthing.

First off This is the initial Wiring diagram the best I can chase down and understand. There are a few Wires in the red boxes that I have theories on what they are but nothing definitive. Please feel free to comment if you know that they are.

Picture of unidentified wires.

I already had the panels installed before delivery in parallel. The PWM controller was just not efficient enough and my lithium batteries needed to be in the passthrough. My initial hope was just to do a replacement of the GoPower PWM controller in the same place that it was. Turns out the new MPPT controller was much bigger and had to be located closer to batteries in the passthrough also. Those the old PWM controller was just disconnected and left in place. The wires did provide me a way to patch the solar panels through to the front of the travel trailer without much fuss.

Here is the new wiring design.

I chose to leave most of the trailer wiring alone and only connect the DC trailer feed ad the 40A fuse from above. This made things much simpler and they could be done on the backing there in the passthrough. Some other design choices I made was to install the solar panels in series rather than in parallel. I also connected the "Solar on the side" connections in parallel with the rooftop solar array. This was done to allow me to get just a solar suitcase with no controller and feed it into my current MPPT controller. I added a dual pole disconnect to be able to remove the solar panels from the system. Due to the fact that the 2 panel arrays may be different voltage I installed Blocking Diodes to prevent damage to other equipment and kept the 30Amp and 20 Amp fuse protections.
I chose the Renogy 60A MPPT controller in order to keep things on the same app as my current 200Ah Renogy battery. It is sized to handle 900W of PV for the 12V system.

Here are the pictures of the Final product after install before putting up Panel protections.

Future Upgrades will be adding a 2nd 200Ah Battery and also picking up the Renogy 400W Solar Suitcase panels. This should sufficiently do most of my boon docking needs. I may also upgrade the Inverter from the 1800W to a 3000W unit.

I hope this helps some in the future and look forward to any discussion about what I did.

How did a UT Vol make it all the way to Longmont, CO? I grew up in Longmont.

Thanks for the pics and info. I too am upgrading my SOC and batteries. Having seen what you have done I am seriously considering moving my batteries to either the passthrough or possibly under the dinette seat. How did you patch the solar wires from the GoPower to the passthrough? Where do they run? I appreciate any help you can give with this. Thanks

 

[UT_Vol]

How did a UT Vol make it all the way to Longmont, CO? I grew up in Longmont.

Thanks for the pics and info. I too am upgrading my SOC and batteries. Having seen what you have done I am seriously considering moving my batteries to either the passthrough or possibly under the dinette seat. How did you patch the solar wires from the GoPower to the passthrough? Where do they run? I appreciate any help you can give with this. Thanks

Well kept moving west, saw big mountains and said I should just stop here.

So I ended up taking the GoPower out of the loop completely. All models are slightly wired different so your mileage may vary. On my unit they ran directly down the cabinet thru the floor and with a bundle of wires headed to the Battery. The Ground wire terminated there on the frame. The Positive Red wire Rand with the bundle straight to a 30 Amp fuse then to the battery side of the battery disconnect switch.

As for all of the components, I will try to find the part numbers for everything but you really should double check things with your setup. I may even end up changing some components later. Hope this helps.

Thanks

 

[UT_Vol]

Re: 3,000w inverter, are you sure you need one that big? What are you planning on running at the same time?

I am using a 2,000 watt (4,000 watt surge) inverter which for me is more than enough to run my microwave. That's my main use as I find it more battery friendly to heat coffee water on stove and power TV and Starlink directly from battery power.

I realize what works for me may not for others but if no need for the large inverter batteries will end up happier.

Most likely a good 2,000 watt inverter would likely to do everything i need. But the WD inverter specs are not all that good and will not run the microwave.

• Inverter
  • Model: WF-5318
  • Description: 1800Watt Pure Sine Wave
  • Manufacturer WFCO
  • AC Input Pass Through: 120 VAC, 60Hz, 24.8A Max
  • AC Output: 115 VAC, 60Hz, 1800 Watts / 15.7A Continuous
  • DC Input: 12VDC Nominal, 180A Continuous
  • Draw no load 1.6 A — 1.6*12.8=20.48W

My thoughts on the 3,000 Watt inverter, was to be able to run the A/C in a pinch. I would have to still run the numbers and the overall to see if i would get any more that 5 mins or run time lol.