Where is my Hot Water valve (and what is this rocker switch for)?

[keithcolter]

Hi folks
I'm trying to find the valve to turn on my hot water, I'm hoping someone can guide me (2003 Forest River Sunseeker). I've looked around the hot water tank, no luck. I'm attaching an outside pic of the hot water heater. Also I'm trying to figure out how to turn on the furnace. Finally, I'm wondering what this rocker switch is for (its inside the side door, beside the DC cutoff switch). An LED illuminates when turned on, but I have no idea what it does. Thanks!
Keith

 

[wmtire]

You have a gas/electric Suburban. See this thread. You will need to find the inside switch for the gas/dsi operation. The electric operation switch is in your pic, just hidden a little. The thread below will show you.

Suburban's electric switch and much more

Just a few basics for anyone else who may read this thread later on in life. There are SIX posts in this thread, and please read all six. WARNING: Always make sure the water heater is full of water before using it either by propane or the electric heating element. This is explained in more...

www.forestriverforums.com

This pic is from the tutorial link above:

 

[wmtire]

Edit: Here is where your switch is for the electric heating element (red arrows), behind the gas tube on the back wall. It's just to the left of the large oval shaped black plastic cover, which is the cover for the heating element. Please read the thread link provided above before you mess with it, so you don't burn up the element.

 

[wmtire]

Show us the panel where the switch is for your water pump. Your water heaters gas/dsi heating mode switch may be located there. We can spot it for you easily.

 

[jimmoore13]

RE: hot water heater. You said "valve" not switch. Where to find the valves.
Access to the "winterizing valves" for your hot water heater will be inside the rig...directly behind the hot water heater. The heater is typically mounted in the exterior wall where the heater itself can live in the cavity created by a dinette bench seat or similar. It could be under your bed. Less likely, it's in the back of a cabinet hidden by a protective panel that comes off with 4 screws.

Whatever is directly inside the rig behind the hot water heater as viewed from the outside is where the main body of the hot water heater lives. And that's where the valves are. You might need a screwdriver to remove a screw holding a plywood cover over the heater. In two consecutive campers, mine has always been in the dinette booth seat.

Furnace: typically the furnace responds entirely to the thermostat. No master switch. There is usually a slide switch on the thermostat for "on/off". Then you set the thermostat to "demand" heat. If it's 75 degrees in the cabin, you'll need to set the thermostat to 80 degrees or more to force it to start.

While the body of the furnace proper may have a switch on it, that's usually buried inside the cabinet that houses the furnace, so you have no access to that switch.

If your thermostat makes "something" happen...some furnace noise in response to the call for heat, then the thermostat is probably no the culprit. I the thermostate makes NOTHING happen, remove the thermostat from the wall (cover snaps off then 2 small screws) and check the wires to the thermostat. Just two wires for heat. Chances are your air conditioner is not controlled by the thermostat, but if it is, there will be 4 wires. Two for heat and two for cool. Easy. Do yourself a favor and replace the thermostat with something from this century. My 2020 rig came thru with a mechanical antique and I ditched it right away for the one in the link. Nothing special about mine...shop around. THEY ALL WORK THE SAME. On/off/On switch for heat/off/AC. I don't have thermostatically controlled AC in my rig or in my home. That thermostat, with just two wires, controls my furnace at home and in the RV. Couldn't be easier. Whether this fixes your problem or not, you'll be happy you made the swap.

Now...if you know the stuff about the thermostat already, you might be experiencing a problem with your furnace. There are several problems, but I'll mention a likely one. The "Sail Switch". Symptoms of a problem sail switch. You call for heat with the thermostat, the blower fan starts and runs for 15 or so seconds, you might or might not hear other clicks and noises (usually not), then the furnace shuts down. You must turn the thermostat off then on again to get it to try again. Usually no miracles happen. Your sail switch may be dead or dirty. Depending on your DIY skills, a sail switch replacement is pretty easy. If you can't deal with the sail switch, the other possible problems (control board, gas valve, etc.) are harder still. You can call a mobile RV repair to deal with the furnace if the thermostat doesn't perform magic.

Mystery switch: My rig has a light under the stairs outside. The switch for my light is similarly located...down low, near the steps into/out of the rig. A 2003 rig most likely has all incandescent bulbs, and a 22 year old bulb might be burned out. If my hunch is right, look for a fixture of some sort under your stairs. See if you can remove the lens over the light fixture, remove the incandescent bulb and replace it...or better yet, get the number off the dead bulb and find an LED bulb replacement. While you're at it, upgrade all the bulbs in your rig with aftermarket LED replacements and/or replace aging fixtures with LED fixtures. Your eyes will thank you, and so will your battery. If this switch does control an outside "stairs" light, FYI, mine is "blue" and not all that bright. It's just meant to light up the steps when it's dark, but it's a pretty low wattage bulb. If you replace the whole fixture (presuming you want this feature), you'll probably want something that puts out low lumens for a simple reason. This light is very easy to forget to turn off...out of sight out of mind. Very often you'll forget to turn it off and leave it on all night...annoying neighbors and draining your battery if you are boondocking. Ask me how I know.

Of course, these are all shots in the dark. My solutions may not fit your problems.
Good luck.

 

[jimmoore13]

P.S. On the furnace.
Obviously you must have propane to the furnace for it to run. Not only that, however, you frequently must "prime" the propane plumbing serving the range, hot water heater, furnace and fridge. Most of all the fridge.

Priming is simple. Turn on your propane. Use a long "stick lighter" as a pilot light. Light the lighter, open a range top burner valve, and wait. If you have just changed tanks or recently run out of propane, it may take 10 seconds for the range burner to light. And when it does, it will sputter and fart and protest, but when the burner is running smoothly, light the other one or two burners for a few seconds...preferably with your built in spark igniter if that still works.

Now, once your range is primed, and once you've figured out how to open the valves to the hot water heater, throw the propane switch on the hot water heater and let it run for a bit...30 seconds or so. (Never run the hot water heater without water in it.) The hot water heater is less fussy than the furnace. THEN try to run the furnace. FINALLY, only after all 3 are running properly, try to run the fridge on propane. Why that order? Because the fridge has a tiny burner by comparison, and it can't possibly purge the lines of all the air and "non-propane" in the propane plumbing. But it can prime itself if all the other appliances are running properly. Even then, however, it might take several tries to get the fridge running if you ran out of propane and all the appliances burned off what little was in the lines.

 

[keithcolter]

Hi folks
I'm trying to find the valve to turn on my hot water, I'm hoping someone can guide me (2003 Forest River Sunseeker). I've looked around the hot water tank, no luck. I'm attaching an outside pic of the hot water heater. Also I'm trying to figure out how to turn on the furnace. Finally, I'm wondering what this rocker switch is for (its inside the side door, beside the DC cutoff switch). An LED illuminates when turned on, but I have no idea what it does. Thanks!
KeithView attachment 1112197View attachment 1112198

Thanks for the guidance - I was able to find the Hot Water valve. Once turned it on, the tank filled and I was able to heat it via AC power. However, I still can't figure out how to heat the tank via propane (the propane stove lights fine). I'm thinking that the RV is smart enough to know to light the propane heater when I switch on the HTR rocker switch (see pic), with AC disconnected. However I can't find any documentation. Does anyone have any advice?
Thanks

 

[wmtire]

Your pic does not show. Can you try to post it again.

 

[keithcolter]

P.S. On the furnace.
Obviously you must have propane to the furnace for it to run. Not only that, however, you frequently must "prime" the propane plumbing serving the range, hot water heater, furnace and fridge. Most of all the fridge.

Priming is simple. Turn on your propane. Use a long "stick lighter" as a pilot light. Light the lighter, open a range top burner valve, and wait. If you have just changed tanks or recently run out of propane, it may take 10 seconds for the range burner to light. And when it does, it will sputter and fart and protest, but when the burner is running smoothly, light the other one or two burners for a few seconds...preferably with your built in spark igniter if that still works.

Now, once your range is primed, and once you've figured out how to open the valves to the hot water heater, throw the propane switch on the hot water heater and let it run for a bit...30 seconds or so. (Never run the hot water heater without water in it.) The hot water heater is less fussy than the furnace. THEN try to run the furnace. FINALLY, only after all 3 are running properly, try to run the fridge on propane. Why that order? Because the fridge has a tiny burner by comparison, and it can't possibly purge the lines of all the air and "non-propane" in the propane plumbing. But it can prime itself if all the other appliances are running properly. Even then, however, it might take several tries to get the fridge running if you ran out of propane and all the appliances burned off what little was in the lines.

Thanks for taking the time to explain all this for me Jim. I've been able to prime the propane to get both the propane stove and furnace working, however not the propane hot water heater. While I did find the water valve to fill the water tank, you mention a "propane switch". The only propane switch (valve) I can find is back on the propane tank itself. I'm including pics of the propane line that serves the hot water heater. Also there is a pic of the control panel's rocker switch "HTR". Is there typically a valve on the propane line feeding the hot water heater?

 

[wmtire]

That HTR switch controls the gas heating mode of your water heater. Anytime you want to heat the water with propane, you must turn that switch on.

The 120 volt AC electric heating element switch is on the face of the water heater. When you want to heat water with electric element, you must use that switch. There is nothing automatic between the two modes. Please reread that link I provided earlier in post #2 to get a better understanding how the heating modes work independent of one another......as well as you can use BOTH modes at the same time.

This is one of the most confusing things for RV owners, thus the very detailed FAQ thread about it.

The little lamp to the right of the HTR switch is your DSI fault lamp....also explained in the link per post #2.

 

[wmtire]

One more addendum, as the two heating modes work independent of each other, they have two separate thermostats attached to the tank wall. If the water is already heated by say the electric element, then turning on the gas switch will not make the propane immediately fire up...since the water is already heated. The temp must fall enough in the tank (thru usage or time) that the thermostat closes thus allowing the propane to fire up. Once heated, then both modes thermostats will open thus not allowing power to heat......until the water temp falls enough again to close the thermostats.

See post #9 here:

2012 shasta revere suburban hot water tank electric/gas

Okay... here we go... our 2012 Shasta our hot water just stopped working on ELECTRIC only, it works on propane but not on electric. Everything is opened proper. We tried the restart, replaced the anode rod and nope nothing. The red light stays on, it clicks to indicate it's igniting but nothing...

www.forestriverforums.com

 

[keithcolter]

That HTR switch controls the gas heating mode of your water heater. Anytime you want to heat the water with propane, you must turn that switch on.

The 120 volt AC electric heating element switch is on the face of the water heater. When you want to heat water with electric element, you must use that switch. There is nothing automatic between the two modes. Please reread that link I provided earlier in post #2 to get a better understanding how the heating modes work independent of one another......as well as you can use BOTH modes at the same time.

This is one of the most confusing things for RV owners, thus the very detailed FAQ thread about it.

The little lamp to the right of the HTR switch is your DSI fault lamp....also explained in the link per post #2.

These posts are helping me figure out the propane water heater operation, thanks for that. Knowing that the LED on the rocker switch (to the right of the HTR label) is a Fault indicator is interesting. The LED will light up after the rocker switch is set to the left, sometimes right away and sometimes after a few seconds. So this is telling me that the propane is not igniting when the switch is activated. To confirm, the water temperature is cold. I am assuming that I would hear the propane fire up on ignition, is that correct?

 

[Willhound]

You would definitely hear it. Our hot water tank is located under a clothes closet in in our bedroom and the DW gets woken up if it kicks in at night which is why I leave it on electric. I turn on the propane if we are doing a bunch of dishes or if others are having a shower for faster re-heat.

 

[jimmoore13]

Thanks for the guidance - I was able to find the Hot Water valve. Once turned it on, the tank filled and I was able to heat it via AC power. However, I still can't figure out how to heat the tank via propane (the propane stove lights fine). I'm thinking that the RV is smart enough to know to light the propane heater when I switch on the HTR rocker switch (see pic), with AC disconnected. However I can't find any documentation. Does anyone have any advice?
Thanks

Focusing on propane hot water heat.
Since you've primed your propane lines by running the stove, IN GENERAL, this is what you should expect and steps you should follow:

• I'm not sure where you found the switch for the ELECTRIC part of your hot water heater. Many times, the switch is inside the heater compartment. Mine, however, is on the main control panel inside the rig...where you find the ceiling lights, slide control, awning control, and so on.
  But this is almost always where you'll find the switch for the propane part of your hot water heater. If the propane switch is on this main panel, it will be marked.
  In my case, my two switches (electric and propane hot water) are clearly marked.
• Now you need a helper.
• While standing outside at the hot water heater, have your helper turn on the propane switch. Your job is to listen for the telltale ticking of the electronic spark igniter...tick, tick, tick. If you hear that, great. If you don't hear the ticking of the spark igniter, given your inquiry, this is probably not a DIY job. Most mobile RV repair services will come to you and be able to fix this.
• Assuming you hear the ticking of the igniter, there are several more things you can do DIY. They are easy.
  • First, remove and clean the burner tube. There are several videos on the subject. Some people use a brush. Great if you have such a brush. I like to remove the burner tube, blow it out with air, maybe run a bamboo barbeque skewer thru it wrapped in a rag...in lieu of a brush.
    The trick is that spiders and other such critters like to build webs and nests in burner tubes. Cleaning is regular maintenance.
    IMPORTANT NOTE, burner tube maintenance is also part of keeping the propane side of your fridge running.
  • You might also remove, clean (perhaps with compressed air) and replace the burner orifice.
  • Regardless of whether or not this fixes your problem, looking at the photo with your original post, your hot water heater is pretty crudded up, and it will benefit from this cleaning maintenance.
• While you're in there, look for the obvious....
  • Disconnected wires;
  • Damaged gas line (but you'd probably smell that). To test gas line integrity, get a small pump sprayer and fill it with a strong mix of dish soap and water. Let's say roughly a tablespoon of dish soap in about 1/2 cup of water. Spray this mix on fittings, joints, hoses, pipes, in your propane line. If you get bubbles, you have a leak. No bubbles is what you want.
  • Damage to anything else.
• If you are a pretty good DIY person you can explore more thoroughly. There are tons of videos on YouTube that might be helpful. Here's one. Just an example.
• One other long shot. It's unlikely, but it's possible the wire from your propane switch to the hot water heater has come adrift from the switch at the control panel. You could remove the control panel and take a peek to ensure the wire is still connected.
• Depending on your DIY skills and confidence, if you have spark and you've cleaned the burner tube and orifice and still have no luck, I'd call a mobile RV repair tech to get your hot water heater going and, while there, check out your fridge, too. A 22 year old RV may need quite a bit of TLC, and having this mobile tech on speed dial would be a good idea.

BTW, Most electric/gas hot water heaters will run well with both heat sources turned on. This substantially improves recovery time on the hot water heater.

Best of luck.

 

[keithcolter]

Thanks for the tips Jim. I ran the "sound test", and there is no clicking heard from the sparking mechanism on the water heater, when I set the propane Hot Water rocker switch to the ON position. The LED in the rocker switch will light up within a few seconds of being flipped ON. I really like to fix stuff myself, rather than turn it over to the professionals, but will do so if absolutely necessary. I'll give myself a few more days of tinkering.

 

[keithcolter]

Also, I pulled the sparker and it looks good to me (see pic). I even pushed the two electrodes a little closer together, but it didn't help. Maybe the control circuitry isn't telling the sparker to spark? The propane rocker switch LED will still wait a few seconds before illuminating, so the circuitry seems to be functional. Thoughts anyone??
Thanks,
Keith

 

[keithcolter]

Also, I pulled the control panel out, the board looked OK. I disconnected and re-connected the PIN Connector. The diagnostics (battery level, liquid levels) all perform as they should. Maybe I'll look into getting a new control board. Any thoughts? On a side note, I'm curious what the Galley probe is for??

 

[wmtire]

and just to make sure, the water currently in the tank is cool (not heated by the electric heating element)? Have you briefly flipped up the temperature and pressure (T&P) relief valve lever on the front face of the tank to see if the water is flowing/cool.

 

[Mr. Dan]

Also, I pulled the control panel out, the board looked OK. I disconnected and re-connected the PIN Connector. The diagnostics (battery level, liquid levels) all perform as they should. Maybe I'll look into getting a new control board. Any thoughts? On a side note, I'm curious what the Galley probe is for??

View attachment 1112785

The galley harness with 4 probes is for the kitchen gray tank.

 

[Larry-NC]

On a side note, I'm curious what the Galley probe is for??

Some RVs have THREE waste water tanks, Black, Gray, and Galley. The Galley tank is often for the kitchen sink, and its drain port is at the other end or side of the RV from the drain port shared by the other two tanks.

If your RV doesn't have a Galley tank, it is possible that they were out of the controls that only support two tanks the day yours was built and substituted the other model. That would not be surprising. Historically, the RV world has had bad supply chains.